Positive publicly funded homebirth, mental health (ADHD, Autism, Anxiety), IVF & culturally safe maternity care || Genna's birth of Freddie at home (Victoria)

Episode 68 is shared by Genna who lives on Wurunderji land. After Genna’s IVF journey, she chose to have a homebirth with her first baby, Freddie through the publicly funded homebirth program. She also shares how invaluable midwifery care was during her pregnancy, labour, birth and post partum experience, especially in the context of her significant prior mental health struggles including at the time undiagnosed ASD, and her ADHD, PTSD, anxiety, and then also  having previously had a psychotic episode. 

We also chat about how she factored in her mental health vulnerabilities into her journey and also the benefits of homebirth for those who are neurodivergent. 

Resources: 

• Birth With Confidence: Savvy choices for normal birth (Book)
• Embracing the intensity workshop
• The Birth Space: A Doula's Guide to Pregnancy, Birth and Beyond
• Galinjera Maternity Program
• Possum Skin Cloak 

Transcript

0:02

Welcome to Birthing at Home, a podcast. I'm Elsie, host. I'm a home birth mom of two little boys, a doula in Melbourne supporting birth at home. I'm a mental health nurse and the co-creator of Home Birth Victoria. If you want to learn more about me, the podcast, or my work, check out www.birthingathome.com.au. Before we begin, I would like to acknowledge the Wurundjeri people who are the traditional custodians of the land I'm recording on in Ngaam, Melbourne, Australia. I would also like to acknowledge the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples have been birthing at home on country for tens of thousands of years prior to the British invasion and acknowledge that sovereignty has never been ceded. Episode 68 is shared by Jenna who lives on Warundri land. After Jenna's IVF journey, she chose to have a home birth with her first baby, Freddie, through the publicly funded home birth program. She also shares how invaluable midwifery care was during her pregnancy, labor, birth and postpartum experience, especially in the context of her significant prior mental health struggles, including at the time undiagnosed autism and her ADHD, PTSD and anxiety, and then also having previously had a psychotic episode. We also chat about how she factored in her mental health vulnerabilities into her journey and also the benefits of home birth for those who are neurodivergent. And of course she shares the beautiful birth of Freddie at home. Enjoy. Welcome Jenna to Birthing at Home, a podcast. Hi, happy to be here. Thank you for joining me. And you are located in Melbourne, presumably. Yes. um And it's really hot this afternoon. Yeah, I know surprisingly we got on with the days of rain and now it's it's hot again Very strange weather. But I always love recording with people that are in like the same city as me, because I just find it kind of funny. Anyway, do you want to give the listeners a bit of intro about who you are, who's in your family? you, they obviously know where you're located now, that kind of thing. yeah, yeah. So my name's Jenna and I live in Westfootscray with my husband Ben and our 16 month old daughter, Freddie and our chocolate Labrador, Monty. eh learned. And so Freddie, like the best name is Freddie Short for something or it's just Freddie. No, so it is just pretty. I love it. Yeah, we saw it one day and we both just went, my god, that is the best name ever. I think it was like four months into my pregnancy and I was like, yep, we've got it done. I love it so, so much. I'm slightly jealous. I love my kids' names, Murphy and Frankie. Um, but Freddie, that's- Yeah, yeah, same thing. Yes, I'm still cool. And so you had Freddie through a publicly funded home birth program here in Melbourne, yeah. Yeah, yep, that's sunshine. Yep, cool. um I suppose to start off with like, what, like, how did you come to find home birth? Like, especially the publicly funded program, they're usually um tough to get into. you usually kind of have to have an awareness that they exist in the first place, but like, what was your um journey to finding um birth at home? Yeah. so I know they are they're sort of like this mysterious thing. I don't know. I um guess, I mean, I'll probably go into this a little bit later. But I um went through the IVF journey and found that quite obviously quite medicalised. Yes. And speaking to my sister who'd had a home birth, she just absolutely raved about how amazing it was. That was her second birth. The first one was in the hospital. Yeah. And yeah, she just totally info dumped me with all of the things birth when we found out that we were pregnant. um Yeah. And yeah, I looked into it. And initially, my IVF clinic referred me I said, Can you refer me to m the Sunshine Hospital because I want to do a home birth. And I think they missed the home birth bit. So they directed it straight to the hospital. Okay, which then declined because they said we were out of the area. Yeah. And I was meant to go to um Royal Women's but yeah, I ended up contacting them directly and she said, my god, yes, we can definitely take you. Often that's what happens. So yeah, I was really surprised by that too. But yeah, anyway, so contacted them, did the questionnaire and everything. And yeah, she I think she contacted me the next day and said, Wow, you're in was amazing. Wow. um What do you mean about you were out of the catchment for the home birth program or for Sunshine Hospital? Yeah, for sunshine. I think maybe. Yeah. uh wow. I had never really considered that the home birth uh radius would be different to the actual zoning of the hospital. Zoning is like, um I didn't know this, but zoning uh is not everywhere in Australia. So if you don't know what zoning is, like in Melbourne, in Victoria, I don't know if it's just a city thing, but you are not allowed to just pick whatever hospital. usually uh without good, really, really, really, really good reason that you want just for people that aren't aware. So anyway, so you were in the radius for the Home Birth program. That's fantastic. And so had you ever like had you thought about private midwifery versus the publicly funded program? Yeah, definitely. I think when I felt, because I think it was probably a month or so between when I requested Sunshine and then followed up with the Home Earth program. in that time, I kind of was quite disappointed and I was like, it's something I really want to do. Started looking at private midwives and started emailing them and looking into it a bit more. uh But then obviously with it came the influx of um you know, the costs and everything and my whole hour in the middle of a house, you know, yeah, so I was sort of like, Oh, I don't know. And, know, discussions with my sister and she was just like, it's the best, you know, it's going to be the best investment. Yeah. And, you know, now I see that so much. But yeah, then when I looked into it a bit more, I was like, Oh, I'm just going to find out a bit more, I'm going to push this a little bit more. And that's why I contact them directly. Yeah. But yeah, I definitely if I obviously her back and I definitely would have looked at the private midwives. If that wasn't, yeah. If that option was sort of not an option. Yeah. Cool. And so with your IVF journey, because that is like quite a common thing that it is obviously what like, I guess, from my perspective, like one of the most medicalized kind of it's kind of like a science experiment, really like thing that you can do. It's quite on the other spectrum of, um, physiology, I guess. did that play? Like, did you have to work through anything in particular to arrive at, you know, obviously, did you say it was your sister or sister-in-law? Your sister had had this really positive experience, did you have like particular fears or concerns around home birth? Um, I think it was probably just my lack of education around it. And you know that, I mean, obviously being in it now and being around other birthing people and, um, seeing and just learning so much about the natural physiological birth and processes, hormones and things. Um, but yeah, initially I was a bit kind of, and particularly before I was impregnant, um, chatting to my sister, I was sort of being like, Oh, I don't know. You know, what's like all the classic sort of things like what if something goes wrong or you know, yeah, it's gonna be scary. You're gonna need pain medication, you know, all of those unknowns. But then I think the more that I did a deep dive into educating myself and you know, previously a teacher so I was just want to know I just want to learn just want to get all the information I can. And once I started learning about it and reading about it. um Yeah, I just felt I was like, Oh, that's sounds like best possible thing to do for my health for one, but also to feel empowered. I think that's the biggest thing that came from Home Birth for me is the feeling of being empowered, which is really important. Yeah, cool. what was your uh partner or other family members, were they on board or what was their perspective of home birth? Yes, I think when I started reading and my sister dropped off, you know, this huge massive different books, everyone. Yeah, she sort of, yeah, pulled me on with all these podcasts and everything. And, you know, I think my husband was flicking through one, he was looking at Rhea Dempsey's Birthing with Confidence and, and he's like, Oh, yeah, I think I'm going to take this and read it. He started reading it before I did. Oh, wow. So his like, you know, his initial thoughts were, Oh, I don't know. You sure? You know, just classic. um Same like not knowing anything. And then him going, Yeah, this is a really good thing. Yep. We should do it. Yep. Let's book him for her classes. And wow, he actually really took it on. Yeah, think. Yeah. A big part of that is that, you know, it was, yeah, that that empowerment, I guess, but that it was something that I was passionate. about doing for myself and doing for our baby and doing for us. um that I think had this, yeah, this real strength coming from it. And um he was able to see that. And so he was like, yep, I'm going to support you all the way. was, yeah, amazing. Yeah, that's fantastic. so um when did you like your experience of like going through the publicly funded model, like how how are your appointments set up? Like what was your experience um in pregnancy with, you know, meeting your midwife or like having me like what was that? How did that look? Yeah, so it was really positive. It was really good, really relaxed. It's yeah, like we we met our midwife and she was really lovely. And it was just really sort of casual and sometimes hospitals really beautiful as well like the redone. And that's great. Yeah. And yeah, I remember going in and feeling so relaxed and that she was just really kind and caring and you know she shared her number and she shared all these links to things and um was really informative and yeah I just felt held immediately like I felt like that she's here she's doing this specifically you know and yeah she's like as a midwife she's working specifically with Homebird so she knows her stuff and yeah I just felt really trusting of her and yeah and then our appointments were great. Like she would just sort of text us and say, Yep, the rooms ready to come in, you know, felt really personal. Yeah. And, yeah, and you know, gave us the option to be able to do the appointments um at home as well. um But we said, you know, it's good to go in just in case and be familiar with the environment anyway. So yeah, yeah, yeah, really understanding of and really curious about my mental health journey. Um, prior, so that also was really good. made me feel really safe and secure. Yeah. Yeah. But it was fantastic. Yeah. Yeah, cool. I guess in the context of like the emotional journey that is pregnancy and labor and birth and how our, you know, life experiences and mental health and whatever plays a role in all of that. Are you able to like speak a little bit about what that looked like for you? Yeah. So, I was actually really surprised. Like when I got pregnant, I was quite sick, but, yeah, I was actually quite surprised at how good I felt emotionally. Yeah. Did amazing things to me. Yeah. Um, was pretty incredible. in comparison, cause yeah, a few years prior, had a pretty significant mental health episode. Um, I have ADHD and so my anxiety was through the roof and I ended up having a period of psychosis and was hospitalized. So that was um yeah, pretty massive. that was sort of in the midst of our infertility journey or fertility journey. And so yeah, there was lots of factors that kind of contributed, but I think the hormones were one and then, you know, being a teacher coming back. after COVID was another one and PTSD was another one. There was lots of things kind of thrown in, yeah, bit of a cocktail that didn't quite work out. yeah, so I think going through that experience and being in the hospital system, I was at St. Vincent's for a little bit and that was really scary and really intense. then going into another hospital and so yeah, being in that environment and then on top of that going into for the fertility treatment. um Yeah, when I got pregnant was then sort of looking at that and wanting something different for, know, wanting that kind of, yeah, warm, sort of, yeah. Yeah, to create for myself so that I would feel comfortable and capable and empowered. And yeah, so I think, yeah, it was really surprising when I was when I did get pregnant. the third time was IVF. So it was the first time with IVF. Yeah. And yeah, I think a big part as well was having that sort of break of about, I think it was, I think it was about 18 months, um sort of break between that and really slowing down. I took time off work and implemented lots in terms of like my mental health care plan and. Yeah. um It was, yeah, had therapy pretty regularly, which, you know, helped with all those things and yeah, just really stepped off the treadmill and um was able to sort of slow down and focus on, you know, not that I thought all of that, was because, you know, that was why we weren't getting pregnant, but yeah, it's definitely a key factor, I think. Yeah, interesting. Yeah. Yeah, well, I like it, guess in my work, uh something like psychosis, which, um you know, for you and I, maybe it's like. um Easier, I don't know if easier to talk about is the right word, but it's not as I suppose, stigmatized to us, but in the general population it is, but um you know, any. anybody can experience psychosis. um It's not just, you know, drugs or because you have a psychotic illness. And yeah, in my work, we refer to it as like the the stress bucket. And when you you know, the bucket fills up too much. The water has got to go somewhere and sometimes, uh you know, due to certain vulnerabilities, whether it's trauma or Biological makes you more likely for that to, you know, that overflow to look like something like psychosis. But um yeah, and how that plays out in, um you know, physical symptoms like fertility. Yeah, that's, yeah, quite a journey that you've had to, yeah, having Freddie, that's like pretty incredible. That's yeah, really amazing. Yeah, I think it's, really appreciate you saying it in that way, because I think initially hearing that and especially, you know, being diagnosed with different things, I was like, what, you know, there is that stigma massively. Yeah. It happens all the time. Yeah. Even, yeah, speaking to friends and family about what happened and yeah, just, yeah, just receiving those like normalising comments. was helpful for me in recovery, think, as well. um I'm glad. Yeah, and I suppose, I mean, you don't have to go into it if you don't want to, but was there ever a concern then that you would be more vulnerable to developing something like postpartum psychosis? Yeah, absolutely. And it's really interesting because I remember when I was diagnosed and my psychiatrist said, you know, it's an isolated incident. And like you were saying, like the stress bucklet. um And because I had really prioritized my mental health going through pregnancy and I had really good conversations with my midwives and my psychotherapist, leading up to it, I felt in good stead around it. And actually later in my pregnancy, we were getting some testing done and my um midwife wasn't available. And we had another midwife and she raised it. And I remember I was feeling quite triggered. um And my husband just kind of went into protective mode and he was like, why are you even bringing that up? You know, um you know, I sort of I guess I was, he was probably more triggered than I was to be honest. And I was able to probably was the hormones too, where I was like, Oh yeah, you know, that's a pretty relevant question to ask. But he obviously was really traumatic for him to witness that. And so he, he was like, Oh, I really think that was out of line for you to ask and all this stuff. And we sort of debriefed about it afterwards. I spoke to him, my therapist about it and she was like, look, there's, you've got all these things in place. um And it was, yeah, an isolated incident. Even with like postpartum depression and um your anxiety and stuff. She's like, we've got this toolkit set up for you. And m now had those experiences that if you were um yet to go down, that route or if you were not feeling okay or, you know, we were able to have those conversations and I could, yeah, speak like if I was feeling a panic attack coming on or something like that. Yeah. Quite prepared to be able to. you know, be the safety net, I guess. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, cool. But I think after speaking with her, that was really validating for me to and made me feel a lot better because I think not so much the psychosis but but definitely postnatal depression, were on my radar. And, know, because it's just so incredibly common. And um yeah. that it was definitely on my radar. We were planning for that. had a mental health plan. We had strategies written out. mean, post, like, there's so many factors that can contribute to like, that destabilization of like your mental health for anyone postpartum, but when you have different vulnerabilities, like it's, yeah, so fantastic that you were able to implement those, yeah, that toolkit or safety net to, yeah, be there in case something you know, you did need to be caught. think, yeah, it's a shame that the system uh doesn't really do that itself. Like it's not really built to, you know, uh provide that. I want to say like holistic care from like all the way through. It's kind of like, know, I guess in a very general sense, but you had your baby. Now you get a midwife for six weeks or whatever. And then you're off to your maternal child health and it's like very fragmented, I guess. And if you need to put in those extra things. It's yeah, can sometimes be a lot, but that's, that's fantastic. And so you felt quite good throughout your whole pregnancy or were there like, how was your pregnancy in general? Yeah, so I felt like my mood was really quite good. I felt pretty energetic. For a lot of my pregnancy, I was still helping, helping with the reno's at our house. Yeah. Classic. got to a point where my dungarees got a bit too tight. there's also this kind of like, I'm gonna teach my baby girl that she can be strong and you know. she could do anything. Girl power. Yeah. I am woman. Yeah. Playing Spice Girls on the workshop while all these jokers are walking around. It's hilarious. that woman doing? uh So yeah, that was it, you know, good. mean, at the same time, like I was, I was quite sick too. Definitely not, you know, on the, on lower end of the spectrum, but yeah, I was vomiting pretty much every day. And just, you know, stuff in my face, in my face with crackers and you know, with vomits in the car and all that sort of fun stuff. Yeah. But I think. Oh yeah. I was like super swollen towards the end. And yeah, my ankles, I had to end up getting an ultrasound of my ankle and stuff. they're like, no, you're just really swollen. um, it was pretty crazy. one point, my best friend like pushed down on my foot and it took like a good minute for the. my gosh, that's so bad. I need foot massages every day. Yes! uh, what month or what season was Freddie born in? Okay. So I guess it would been warming up. Yeah. Yep. I remember, think it was, I remember, it 40 gram final that we went to and that was when the push test of my foot happened and people were like, get off your feet. ah You need to get off that work site. Yeah. I was talking about that then. yeah, so I think, yeah, it sort of started, you know, pretty sick and that kind of lasted probably about, yeah, I reckon three quarters of the way. Yeah. And then start to feel better. And then like just was feeling really good. Like we went, think it was the week before Freddie was born. I had my best friend's hen's party and we were at karaoke and there's this video of me like 38 weeks pregnant singing karaoke and in these like heels and oh my god everyone was like get her out like getting all these weird looks my gosh. that's brilliant. um And so through the through your pregnancy, so you did you see the same midwife or the same couple of midwives throughout or how did that work for you? Yeah, so we had the same one midwife. And then because they obviously we needed two for the home birth, we were introduced to our second one, I think, to two appointments before our last one. yeah, we met her a couple of times and she was really lovely. And um yeah, immediately felt really comfortable with her as well. And yes. Yeah. So yeah, I don't know. It was really really seamless actually. um cool. And did you, what was your partner uh husband's name again? Ben, did you or Ben um do like any extra like education, like as aside from whatever your midwife sort of like imparted upon you? Yeah, so we did the rear dempsey birth classes. They were incredible. That was the best thing I did my whole pregnancy, think, apart from you choosing to do a home birth, reckon. Yeah, Which, you know, go hand in hand. Yeah, yeah, But yeah, we did the classes over a weekend and it was just incredible. Like, she's just amazing. um And she really you how it is. did her birth attendant training last year. And so as you would have experienced probably as well like that you have to as one of your her students you have to attend one of the weekends. And it was just really funny because like so many people and I don't know how many home birth couples were in your particular weekend, but it's just No, she really zones in on those that are not birthing at home and just, yeah, like somebody has to be upfront. Somebody has to tell the truth and give facts. Yeah, I was like I feel like an a grade student here. Yeah, she's like and anyone that's she's like telling all these facts about you know All these things that you know interventions and then she looks at me and there was two there's two of us. Yeah, You homeburshers you'll be fine. Don't worry about it. uh No, it's not like that, oh it's obviously very validating. um it was really validating. And I think, yeah, you know, having that. um Yeah, the way that my brain works, like hearing facts and figures and hearing that research and hearing that evidence base. And yeah, that was just incredible. Like, I just couldn't. Yeah, it was amazing. And yeah, we met this other home birth couple who we are now like really good friends with and we're going away. our daughters were born I think two weeks apart and oh my goodness going away together over Easter and yeah we've just stayed in touch and this has been awesome. Oh, that's so special. That's very cool. Yeah. What a, yeah, I guess in Melbourne, we're quite lucky to have Ria here that provides those, you know, weekends. I'll make sure to link that in the description because yeah, it is such a valuable resource and yeah, she really, she, you know, she doesn't tip toe around. No, and just, yeah, just give me the facts and you know, can't argue with the facts. Yeah, this, the stats about different hospitals, like, yeah, just, yeah, amazing. yeah, cool. And was there anything else, did you do like anything to prepare yourself for labor or was Rhea's stuff mostly it or? yeah. So mainly her stuff. I think also we did a lot of the spinning babies stuff as well. That was incredible. Um, and actually ended up helping a lot because, um, Freddie was breach and I think about 37 weeks. Um, and yeah, we weren't really sure, um, how that was going to go. And then we'll kind of, yeah, one of those appointments we were looking into having to return her and we ended up just doing the spinning babies and she was like, yep, I'm in the right position now. It was really good. Yeah. The positions are interesting. Yeah, and very difficult to do when you're really pregnant. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I think also it was kind of cool because we just had that that time together, specifically doing something together, you know. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. Like books. Yeah, a different books. Now I can't remember the birth space. um That book I looked at quite a lot. Yeah, a other podcasts and things like that. um and this one, of course. nice. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of the stuff was yeah, Maria's information she said. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it is a very full on weekend. think everybody that participates must be completely uh exhausted from all of the information. It's a pretty full on weekend, week, you know, weekend. And so when preparing to like have Freddie at home, were you planning? So there was going to be the two midwives and Ben, were you planning on having anybody else there or was? We were looking into having like a photographer, a doler, actually yes, I looked into way too late, not too late, but just later in the piece I was like, oh maybe I do want a doler. And yeah, looked into actually a lot of her birth attendants. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, we'll come. But no one was available and I think it got to a point where I was like, oh, we're doing a lot of reading up and it might be actually quite nice just for it to be sort of been an eye. um And then it ended up that someone from the women's was shadowing our midwife on the day of she messaged and said, is it okay if another midwife comes? I'm like, wow. Excellent. Yeah, it was fantastic. Yeah. that must have been. Yeah, that's actually yeah, that must have been around the time because the women started their home birth program at the start of last year and a part of as far as I'm aware, a part of new services developing or starting uh publicly funded home birth programs is that, yeah, the midwives have to train up essentially on how to act. and be in our own birth. so that shadowing process is part of that. So yeah, cool. So you would have contributed to a midwife in the women's home birth program. That's pretty cool. It was so great. And she also just took all these beautiful photos and videos, which was amazing. Well, so you do need a photographer or a doula. No. Yeah, it was kind of the ideal situation. was great. Did you have any like, worries about like any of the criteria, especially, guess, especially, like, you know, going over 42 or 41 plus whatever it is in the publicly public funded. I don't know why that's such an annoying phrase, but the the whole birth program. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I was a little bit concerned about that because I was like, you know, had my heart set on it. um But at the same time, I sort of had got to a point where I was so comfortable with our midwives and the process and, know, I'd kind of got that sort of armor up from Rhea as well of like, you know, declining things that I don't need. And yeah, yes, I felt okay about that as well that if I needed to transfer to hospital or if I needed to go in, that I'd still have those kind of protective factors around me. um yeah, I think earlier in my pregnancy, I was a little bit concerned about that, but then towards the end, I sort of felt a bit more um in control of those things. yeah, I mean, obviously things can be completely out of your control. Yeah. You know, I felt comfortable being able to, yeah, switch into that. think just, yeah. time and preparation. Yeah. Nice. And so in the end, how many weeks were you when you went into labor with Freddie? Yeah, nice. Okay. And what was the lead up to labor like? Did you have any signs of like labor or that your body was repairing or? Um, not well when I was 38 weeks in the week previous, um, doing karaoke at my friend's ends. Yes. We were sort of walking back. My sister and I were walking back, um, downtown and I was like, Oh my God, I think my water's just broke. And my sister's like, Oh my God. Yeah. Like fully preparing me. We're in this cab. And anyway, it was a false alarm. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I think that really shocked me. Good story. we're gonna get I know I was like, damn it. That's annoying. wasn't. But since then, which was, know, about five days, I definitely was like, some, you know, there's a bit going on here. You know, that was a bit unusual. But who knows? I mean, really, yeah, it could have been the start of it. But yeah, it really started at about 430 in the morning. And yeah, woke up to my waters breaking. Yeah, probably. And yeah, and I went to the bathroom and I remember just going, Oh, what like and then feeling crampy. Yeah, well, I felt like pretty much immediately. Yeah, yeah. And going, Oh, this feels like my period. Yeah. And that's so weird. Like, maybe it was something I ate because we had friends come over the night before. And I think just in my head, you know, I had 40 weeks in my head. Yeah. I was like, Yeah, no, like, no one ever. No. And, and then I was like, this sort of feels like my period. And then, you know, kind of putting two and two together at 430 in the morning. I was like, Oh my God, today I think is the day. yeah, it was just this sort of realization. And then just like, I was flooded with this. Yeah. Positive emotion probably. Yeah. It was making its way in. Um, and yeah. And I remember going back, going back into bed and just telling my husband and he was like, all right, well, we better get as much sleep as we can then. I was like, okay. Yeah. Yeah. True. You know, I'm not just going to like start my day now. If I can just sleep for a little bit more. Yeah. And you know, contractions hadn't started intensely or anything yet. um, yeah. So I back to sleep for a few hours and then, um, got up and, you know, straight away it was like, all right, so we've got to do, you know, this oxytocin menu, you know, and, you know, look at all the cute dog videos and stuff and. eat a really yummy breakfast and all these things that will make me happy and yeah, on this labor. And I remember turning to my husband and going, Oh, you know, like, let's just go to the dog park because I love dogs. And I was like, we can go for a walk. And I remember walking around the dog park and just like patting all these dogs and being all really excited and then just going, my God, this is so weird. Like I'm going to labor. All these people like our neighbors don't know how funny. uh That is one of the funniest things. uh What? And then it was like, sure we should leave the house? Like, you want it? And like, no, it's not that bad. Like, you know, we can, you know, I'm definitely not like curled over anything yet. So yeah, fresh air, cross on dog park. Yeah, what more could you want? That's brilliant. That's so good. uh from then I think the other thing was that was the day that Optus went down. So, my gosh, all the I didn't know this, but all of the hospitals are Optus. Yeah! Oh my gosh, was that a Wednesday? Maybe? I probably should go, but I don't know. No, no, no, just because like I remember that day in my head because I do home with Victoria as well. And I um had a meet up and I just remember like I couldn't communicate with anyone and I do them on a Wednesday. it must have been. Yeah. my gosh. That's so funny. And yeah, like you can get through to ambulances or like so much crazy stuff. Wow. I went from like home birth to free birth in my mind. I was like maybe I can do this You know try to call try to go to the hospital can get through and you know, oh my god, I'm call family and Eventually, I got a message on whatsapp from the hospital for my midwife. She was like just letting you know in case and I was like, well Actually, I've been to the dog park We've went into the dog park. Yeah. Oh, far out. So there was kind of an added layer, but I think I also, yeah, it just, I was like, yeah, no, I can do this. I think, you know, if we get onto them, we do, but if not, you know, we're doing it home anyway. Yeah, that's so awesome. that's, yeah, well. Yeah, I don't know how pleased my husband was about that. I think he was pretty relieved when the message came through. was like, all right, it's not just me. Yeah. not having a free beer. and so what, so that was like in the morning sometime. Yeah, so that was in the morning. um And we'd got everything sort of set up. I had this really beautiful, um like mama blessing that my sister organized for me with a lot of my friends and they'd all made these like stunning. was like, how you guys are artists like these stunning watercolor affirmations to put around my birth space and wow, went down there and started putting those up and, you know, had birth ball and birth circuits of stuff, you know, um and the tens machine which we'd hired and been had tried the night before actually sucked it on him. um yeah, so I felt really good about just kind of taking my time to set that space up. um and Yeah. And then we sort of looked at the pool, which was still wrapped and not inflated. And we needed to inflate this. And yeah, he, we realized we didn't have a pump. because, thought we'd have another week. And so he's like, I'm going to go to Bunnings. So he went up to Bunnings and I was like doing circles on the ball. Yeah. my gosh. like the pool is like not something you can like blow up with. You would like pass out. Oh my God. No. Yeah. had to film you. You could never do that. Oh my God. No way. God, like live like in this. I know. Although we probably would have been a bit more, I mean, you'd hope that we would have been a bit more. It was on the list. was like, finish the deck, you know, organize dog sitter, fill up the pool, like get, yeah, then like, pump, by pump. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. God. Um, so, you know, yeah, we did all the tick off of everything else in Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, he ran off and got that. And yeah, I was doing sort of circles on the ball. And I think by the time he got back, I was feeling definitely feeling contractions. um And he sort of started timing them and everything. And I think it got to about 11 or 12. um And he was like, I think we should check in with the midwives and see how we're going. um And cause I think I was at that point, I was already, was like, maybe I'll put the tens machine on now. Like they're getting a bit more intense. Um, and I had that on pretty much right up. Yeah. I had it on for quite a while. Um, but yeah, so I was using that intermittently and yeah, just sort of moving around. think that was the biggest thing that helped me. think being able to move freely and you know, go outside if I wanted to go inside if I wanted to, um, you know, go in the shower, the water helped a lot. and yeah, so there was a few things that were funny that happened like that. eventually got through to my family and got my mom to pick up my dog. Cause I was like, he's going to go crazy at the midwives when they come and yeah, came and got the, um, got the dog then left again and then came back again. minutes later and was like, Oh, I the key. She was staying at a friend's house around that. She's like, Oh, I the key. I'm sorry. I'm like, good luck. And then I'd organized for someone to come and pick up my laptop for work. And because I thought that I wasn't going to be due until, you know, been the labour until a week later, she just appeared and Ben thought it was the midwife. And I was in the shower at that point. And I was like, Ben, you need to just go and He was just so confused as why she was there and what was happening. she just had no idea that I was in the labor. I'm sorry, it's in the shower. Anyway, and, but yeah, so it was, yeah, I think something that really helped me throughout the labor was thinking about like the role of the different hormones and that they were playing and being aware of like the crosses of confidence and yeah. being aware of ah how I was in relation to how I appeared, if that makes sense? Like for Ben, a uh lot of it, when it got quite into active labor um and even just a bit before that as well, not being able to communicate. um And I think such a big part of why I felt fine was because Ben knew about that and He had that understanding of that, you know, my brain is going to be on task and like, it's going to be, I'm like, mentally, I felt so clear and so sharp. And, and he was saying, yeah, it was like, which I remember from the rear course, she was saying, you know, you're going to look like you're drunk. You're not going to be able to talk and all this stuff. And that's when lots of the partners freak out. And he said, you know, seeing you like that. And I was, he was like, no, I knew that you were fine because were fine. Like you were just, you know, taken over by the hormones and yeah, that was really helpful and really good. Yeah, sorry, I realized I'm kind of rambling. I'm like, do I? Yeah, don't get in. That's perfect. um I think that's a really important part of birth is that, yeah, you do. I mean, you only have to look on Instagram and look at videos and stuff and see like, when you're when you really sink into labor land. Yeah, I mean, you're so overtake like the idea is that, you know, your body is providing all of these endorphins and all of the oxytocin and everything to, you know, provide that um pain relief, you know, and to have everything working in the way that it's working. yeah, side effect or whatever of that is that, yeah, like you look sometimes as if you're completely out of it, but that's that's the whole point. And if you're not um yet aware that that's how it's meant to be, then yet you would freak out. mean, it's it can also be totally sometimes for. Woman, like quite um a strange experience because. Yeah, like there is, you know, in society that, you know, obviously you're alert and you're on and that, I mean, in terms of like trauma as well, like it's like such a vulnerable place to be. it's, it's so important that you can sink into that because that, that's how it's all meant to work. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And I think just understanding that was such a big part um and is why I felt even in that real vulnerable state that I still felt like, no, I can do this. You know, this is normal. And this is, and I think, um yeah, even, yeah, looking at kind of the role of different hormones at different times and having that sort of picture and that image in my mind of like a timeline of what labour can look like was so concrete for me. helped me so much that even I think one part like we had, I had all sorts of things stuck around the room. But I had this this timeline that actually the rear had drawn and shown the role of different like how long these periods can last for. And I just found that such a good tool because For me, and yeah, as I say, my ADHD brain, like having that um visual was just so invaluable because I could just go and I could point to it or like Ben could look at, you know, what he could see and go, she's probably there. And even the midwives, you know, be able to communicate with me as well and say, look, you're here, but you know, you're to get here and this is what you might feel and stuff. just as a talking point was so helpful. Yeah, yeah, Yeah, I like, felt like a kid in the classroom. finger one over here. And so, um so your colleague picked up the computer and whatnot. And so you text like the midwife via WhatsApp, you have to sort of say something's happening. When did they eventually like when did you get them to come? So think they came at about two o'clock. by that time, I was yeah, pretty, pretty heavily contracting. Yeah, yeah. And they were getting closer together. And I don't remember the exact timings. But yeah, they were definitely getting a bit more intense. And I was cranking that tense machine. And yeah, they arrived. So the second midwife, not the one that we've been seeing the whole time, arrived first. Yeah. And yeah, she was like, yep, you're really in it now. And I remember being like, yes, I am. Yeah. Show me. Yeah. Yeah. Show me where I am. Yeah. And she was so lovely. I remember she came in and I was like so relieved to see her and yeah, she was just awesome and just felt made me feel really supported and was just, you know, you can give me those affirmations and stuff and Um, and then I think it was probably about maybe half an hour later, my other midwife came in and I just remember being so relieved to see her as well and just having that, um, yeah, that real, um, yeah, that kind of community around you. Yeah. familiarity as well, Exactly. Yeah. Yep. And was the, when did the shadow midwife come? Yeah. Okay. With her. Yeah. Okay. So everybody's there at that point. Yes. Yep. Yep. So they were like, and that was the other thing. our hot water ran out. Then everyone was on like boiling all the midwif- Well, hot TV. They were like, Ben, you go and support her down there. And then we'll, we'll just be like, you know, in the kitchen making cups of and they were like madly boiling pots and pots of hot water and filling up the, the bath and the birth pool. yeah. And so it was good because you know, knowing that they were there and having that support, but also not needing to heavily rely on them either. Um, it was really nice. And I think really special for Ben and I, because, you know, he was able to, you know, just, I would be leaning with my head in his lap or he would be, you know, brushing my hair or doing acupressure points. Or sometimes I just tell him to absolutely bugger off and yeah, you know, and it was just so good. And I think just him giving me those you know, positive. um Yeah, affirmations, but also like, yeah, cheering me on and just, you know, saying you can do this, you know, that was just so powerful. And I think I just needed him there. um even if he wasn't saying things like, you know, it was just so important for him to be there for me to feel held and yeah, supported. And yeah, it was just, it was amazing that he was able to do that and just be right, you know, right there. um getting his hand absolutely squeezed. uh that's beautiful. And I think um it reminded me of, well, actually something that um Dr. Stu, I think maybe said from like the birthing instincts podcast, and it was more in reference to obstetricians, I suppose. But um I think. Yeah, like that, that's from my perspective, that's how birth should be. It should be like this family centered, unless the, you know, Unless there's something else that's wanted and you want that like, I know some women say they want like, you know, more feminine energy around, you know, their partner can go boil, so whatever. But I think it Yeah, that is really important that if that's something that you want that that is fostered and that, know, the midwives are like the um yeah, well, Dr. Stu called him like that, like the lifesavers on the beach, you know, they're just there in case they're not going to like ruin your fun, like playing in the water or surfing or whatever. But if something happens, then they'll be there, you know, they're not going to like hover over you and like, you know, oh, don't do this or don't do that or what not. And that yeah, that sounds really special that yeah, I can imagine there are three like basically three midwives and like forming like a hot water train. Sounds kind of comical. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And yeah, do you want to walk us through the birth then of Freddie? Yeah. So, um, yeah. So I think got to about, uh, four o'clock and yeah, I was, I was quite heavily in labor and my contractions were pretty intense. And I think by this point I was vocalizing a lot. And, yeah, I just remember, I remember coming up to it, like in my pregnancy and going, my God, like, am I going to make lots of noise and feeling really self-conscious about making noise and um And then on the day just going no, this is my house and like, know, who cares? My name is whatever. Yeah, and we'd actually told my neighbor I was like just so you know, we're having a home birth. So if you it sounds like someone's being there uh But yes, I was vocalizing a lot and that was really really helpful like more than I thought yeah just in terms of like pain, but also just letting it out and and so visualizing the contractions as waves and yeah. So yeah, I was contracting quite a lot and, um I think it, yeah, I remember asking, was like, it got to a point where I was like, Oh, this is, I'm so exhausted. Like I'm really done. Like, and I remember turning to Ben because a lot of my labor up to this point, I just was basically nonverbal um and in the zone and just yes and no. And then I sort of felt this feeling of like coming out of it and going, um, turning to Ben going, my gosh, I don't know how much longer I can do this. And he just like looked at me with a star. Um, and yeah, he didn't actually, but, but yeah. had this big smile and I like what and he sort of whispered something to the midwives and they were like all right hop up like you're go and sit on the toilet for a little while and then you know I want you to have a couple of contractions there and then um you can go into the pool because I was like I don't know how much I can do it um yeah I just want to get in the pool I just want to get in the pool like I'm over moving I'm sore like I'm exhausted I'm sweaty and you know just exhausted yeah and um Yeah. And when sat on the toilet and it wasn't until later that Ben was like, that was probably the crisis of confidence, you know, like, I got so excited when you said that. And I was like, what are you talking about? was just like, And yeah, I had a few contractions on, on the toilet sitting backwards. And yeah, Ben was just there the whole time. And I remember he went and got a like, whole rag and had that on my head and it just yeah, it was just really present and stuff. It was really amazing and then sort of waddled back down into our lounge and got in the pool and that's when things just really started ramping up and you know, the real fire and I just was feeling so, you know, just really in it really animalistic and very loud. have you know, but Yeah, it also felt really amazing as well. Just being so raw and then still so supported with the midwives. And I remember they had the mirror there and they're saying, okay, yep, you're nine or 10 centimeters dilated, you know. They never really, I think it wasn't until sort of later, like I was sort of naturally pushing, but I wasn't really pushing that hard. Like I wasn't, I don't think I was Yeah. I don't think it was mindfully pushing, but I was just sort of still breathing through these contractions and yeah. I remember them saying, okay, if you want, you can do like the horsey lips and you know, breaking technique and to Ben's amusement, I made like a horse sound. I just leant down and he was like, just this. Oh my goodness. It was so, it was funny to think about. At the point I was like, tell me what to do. Like, I'll make horse noises if I want to! God. And yeah, anyway, and then just, yeah, felt, felt that real into I was like, my God, it's everything's gonna rip to pieces, you know? Yeah, just so intense. And yeah, and then, you know, feeling her crowning and the midwife saying to Ben like, Ben's, Ben was sort of leaning on the pool with his head right next to mine. And we've got these beautiful photos where he's just right there, you know. And then her saying to him, you know, you should come around like you'll be able to see the head and he was like, no I cannot move from here and like she's clamped onto me. Yeah, so yeah, they had the mirror and and was sort of pushing my back down and I was just also had this like massive relief that I was in the pool and I was able to have that water birth that I wanted and yeah Yeah, and then just feeling Just that relief so then I actually had the um ejection reflex. I remember having one contraction that was really intense and then the next one where I was like, my god, and then I turned to my midwife and I said that was different. Like that felt like my vagina just vomited. He was like, wow, okay, yep. You know, now you can start pushing and yeah. So I did it. was only a couple of pushes and her head was out and um yeah, then a few more and she kind of swan dove under my legs and I caught her. it was just the most amazing, amazing feeling. And I remember just still being in that, you know, grabbing her and looking at her and thinking, Oh my God, is she real? um, you know, checking her fingers and toes and, and I still was kind of, yeah, in that pattern and rhythm of breathing and vocalizing. So I remember having her and going, Oh, Oh, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, Ben ran around and came over to her and we have this beautiful video from our amazing midwife um of us like, you know, those first moments that was just incredible. Yeah. And yeah, it was just it was yeah, the most incredible experience ever. Yeah, so special that you're able to capture that because yeah, a memory is obviously, know, memories are so important, but, you know, having that physical record of such a moment that you'll you'll never get like no matter how many babies you have like that is so unique to them and to you at that particular time and. Yeah, I don't know about you, but I love watching back the video and whatever else of, know, when, especially when Frankie was born and just, yeah, it's so special, so special. Yeah, I felt it was funny actually because in through my pregnancy, my sister would just message me birth videos. can just be like, Whoa, okay. Yeah. All right. Um, and she's like, don't worry. You'll love it. Like, uh then by the end, I think I was just watching so many. I'm like, my God. Yes. You go. Yeah. I'm so excited. That looks incredible. Yeah. Yeah. You're really powerful. And that almost kind of helped me too. Yeah. Well, think like, yeah, we're like, generally as a society, um you know, we're kind of primed to fear birth and fear the pain and it's scary and we could die and everybody could die and everything could go bad and it's going to be the worst pain ever and blah, blah, blah, blah. But I think, yeah, it's really important to get out there that yes. It's fricking hard work. Like you're literally birthing an entire human from your body. that's like, holy moly. and you know, like that deserves to be, um, you know, celebrated and it's something that you can look forward to and holy moly, like, know, that oxytocin after like, my gosh, like that is addictive. If I could just like give. birth. I don't want to be pregnant. I don't enjoy being pregnant. But if I could just do that, then I would have lots of babies. Because I'm so hooked to that feeling. It just felt, yeah, outstanding. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's just so, it was so special and so like afterwards also just felt, I don't know if we're going to kind of go into this anyway, but felt really hard to talk about because most of my friends either had traumatic traumatic birds or as it didn't go as they'd expected. And, and it was almost this like isolating experience as well, having such a positive birth story. I don't know, even now it feels really weird to say that because I almost feel like this privilege. uh And yeah, and like even, yeah, I think why it's so important to share these stories because um yeah, it does feel really rare. But I also am like, is it because a lot of people aren't talking about the um Yeah. Well, it's kind of like, yeah, it's like a uh very strange thing that I, I don't know if it's like being human. I mean, maybe, I don't know if it's about like our society these days. I don't really know, but we are so addicted to drama. Yeah. And like a positive birth story is usually not that dramatic. um And amongst like, you know, the home birth or pre birth or whatever. community, if you want to call it that. Like there is often like this sense of like, can't share my positive story because, you know, so many people I know didn't have that. And yeah, that sense of like, feel privileged. you know, like thinking about all of the work you did, and it's not like it just... happened, just like fell out of, you know, magic. uh mean, the whole thing is magical, but it's, yeah, it's a lot of hard work, like physical, like spiritual, emotional. know, I guess it's lucky in your sense that, um you know, your sister had had a home birth. And I guess that's the power of story sharing is it just takes one. one person, you I recorded a story earlier today and she, uh, she didn't learn about home birth from it, but she learned about water birth by like a colleague that she once worked with and just that simple idea that you could give birth in water was what led her down to finding home birth. It's like, it doesn't take much, but spreading the word that these things exist and it Like birth doesn't have to be a negative or traumatic experience is so important. Yeah. Yeah. And it's, yeah, it was interesting as well. Cause I remember afterwards kind of discussing this with a few people and someone like, you know, friend saying, you're so lucky with your birth. And I just remember going, is it luck though? I was like, I had a pretty shit time trying to get pregnant. And, um, you know, there was so many things, so many factors that I had to work really hard at and You know, I just did so much learning about things. You know, lot of things that absolutely out of my control. And I definitely acknowledge that it's, it can be extremely difficult for lots of people. Um, but I remember kind of feeling that as a bit of a dagger because I was like, I don't think it was luck, you know? Yeah. Um, I did a lot, I put a lot in place. Um, and yeah, interestingly, I remember chatting with my sister when I was sort of mid pregnancy and we were talking about neurodivergence and I said, Oh, you know, it'd be so good if they're, you know, I wonder if there are some like programs out there that, you know, can support neurodiverse individuals in the birthing process. And, you know, I hadn't really looked into it, but I was like, Oh, you know, like being able to control your space and your sensory sensitivities and, you know, being aware of what was happening and know, that's eventually I was like, well, that's what a homebody is. know, you've got some certainties. um You know, you've you've got your space, you've got your environment, you've got, yeah, so much that you can do and to make yourself feel kind of comfortable and supported and in that cave kind of that yeah, that it was just interesting reflecting on that and going, actually, I kind of created that for myself. m Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I've definitely thought a lot about that as well with Home Birth that, you know, can be such a safe, secure place for especially new to virgin people. um yeah, so I think, yeah, that's just an interesting kind of takeaway that I had. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think about like, like, yeah, I mean, I have this uh sighted sort of obscure interest in uh Australian sign language in Auslan, and I'm waiting to like enroll in a sign language, a site like Auslan course. But part of it, like, you know, the hospital system is built for Well, I want to say like uh a white European man. Um, but like all of these other, you know, the diversity of like the human experience. And I just think, you know, like for neurodiverse or people that are deaf or like from multicultural backgrounds that don't speak ink, like, like what the heck. hospital system is not built to like accommodate for individuality and let you know, let alone individual sensory preferences, like that's, you know, sure, you can, you know, make adjustments to hospital room in some cases. And for some people, the hospital does feel like the safest place, but that's not for everyone. And there's definitely so many elements to hospital that you can't control. Noises, smells, temperature. Um, yeah. Yeah. it's, I mean, in terms of like trauma informed, I mean, I could literally go on, think home birth, home birth, guess, in its, you know, essence, I guess, or like, you know, continuity of care, like having a known midwife, like they're all beneficial because it is actually individual centered care. You know, it's family centered. It's it's one on one. It's not, you know, you're just another product of the machine. So, yeah, I'm really happy that you were able to. Yeah. Yeah, work hard to like achieve that experience for yourself. I imagine that, yeah, the confidence that it would have given you to be able to have that experience, you know, that's sort of unparalleled. Yeah, yeah, it was pretty incredible. And I think, you know, just the sheer, yeah, like I just reflect on after, after the birth, I remember, you know, getting up and being able to walk to the shower, I was walking down my hallway, and, you know, fully conscious fully like just in this, like, oxytocin high and walking into my own shower and having a shower and just going, what the fuck? you know, I'm just at home now and you know, Ben cracking a bottle of champagne, you know, midwife hanging out there and yeah, we rolled out the, the sofa bed and just snuggled up with Freddie and our midwife was there and funnily enough. Yeah, she was like, are you hungry? You know, we ordered grilled and had burgers and rewatched the birth video. She was like, that was the highlight of that day. That's beautiful. What was the birth of Freddie's placenta like? Yeah. So it happened, reckon about half an hour, an hour after. Yeah. Um, so yeah, I said, you know, I'm not in any rush and they were very supportive of that. And, um, I remember, yeah, after, so after I gave birth, Freddie was like awake. She was so awake, so alert and she was trying to nuzzle in and I was like, Oh my gosh, yeah, she's going to try feeding and she nuzzled it. And then I remember going, my god and like feeling cramps again because she was dead. And just going Wow, that's right. I've got to do it again kind of. yeah, yeah. And yeah, so we had this like bowl and um midwife, I was sort of nursing Freddie and then handed her to Ben and Ben had a really nice skin to skin cuddle. um And yeah, it was actually pretty incredible. I sort of stood up and My midwife was like we're just gonna let gravity do its thing So I had a few contractions and then it came slopping out Yeah And she was like wow I think it ended up weighing almost the same as Freddie like it was a It was massive I'm like thank god like that is validating because Freddie yes wonder my legs were so swollen. I'm like two babies. Yeah. It was pretty amazing and um yeah, pretty, yeah, seamless, I think. Yeah. And it was cool as well afterwards because my wife sort of had it up on the bench and was like, do you want a tour of your placenta? And she said, it took me through and let me know other things. And yeah, it was incredible. was so incredible to see. uh I think, yeah, that's definitely such, um such an amazing thing to be able to do and to look at and fascinating and yeah just being able to look at it and reflect and go my god my body just made that from yeah yeah like my baby but yeah Yeah. Yeah. bodies are truly incredible. And what was your, I guess, briefly, what was your post part, like, you know, that initial post part and period like with Freddie? Um, yeah, it was pretty good. I think we just were very much like, we're gonna stick in our own little bubble, you know, did your calls with, with family and stuff. um And I think because I put so much time and energy into educating myself about the birth. One thing that I'm not not I wish I would have learned more about because I think my brain was overflowing. we did. Yeah, that was around breastfeeding. And I remember earlier. um my friend telling me, you know, just get onto breastfeeding association of Australia. And, you know, if you need anything, nurse on call, you know, all of that. Yeah, that was ended up being really helpful because I was so engorged and I was like, I think my milk's coming through, but I don't know. And I was doing some expressing. Yeah. And, and it, yeah, it just sort of had that kind of hormone drop. And I just became really, yeah, I just was at was quite sort of stressed about getting my master artists and So I was like, all right, let's just get on to this. Let's call them. Let's ask them and yeah, got a few really handy techniques and yeah, yeah, she fed pretty well from then had you know, bit of crack nipples and stuff like that. yeah, I was really glad to have known that because I was sort of like, oh, I don't know, like starting to feel a bit nifty and yeah, I was like, no, we've got this, you know, and um was really supportive and yeah, we some, did bit of learning, which is great. Yeah, more learning. Some more learning. And then even just, yeah, the care that we had from the midwives was really amazing, like them visiting at home and being really assuring of the choices that we'd made around co-sleeping and yeah, even just like breastfeeding techniques and stuff like that was just incredible having that support from them. Yeah. And yeah, for them to be able to come to the house and just see her and have all the checks and know that she was all fine and everything was really amazing. um But yeah, I think I feel like my recovery was quite good. Like I had some minor tears, but um yeah, you know, didn't have have any intense recovery or anything. which I was pretty thankful for. um And, you know, be slowly. Yeah. opened our bubble and let people in and meeting her and everything and yeah yeah yeah felt really supported by some friends and family yeah That's fantastic. Thank you so much for sharing your story. As can often happen in storytelling, sometimes you miss info that you really wanted to say. Jenna messaged me later and let me know too that they also got connected to the Gullanjarra maternity program through Western Health here in Victoria. Through this program, Freddie was provided a possum skin cloak, which holds significant cultural meaning for Aboriginal people and has also played a role in Ben's, Freddie's Dad's. own journey to restoring his connection to heritage as an Aboriginal man. You can see a beautiful picture of Ben holding Freddie in the possum skin on the Birthing at Home podcast Instagram. They also buried Freddie's placenta underneath a tree in the backyard. Jenna also wanted to highlight that she was recently diagnosed with autism level one, which has further emphasised why sensory and space factors were so important in her preparation for Freddie's birth at home.