Planned homebirth, FTM, & long labour, turned positive transfer to hospital birth, PFHB || Emma's birth of Lua (Victoria)

In episode 61, I chat with Emma who is a student nurse and midwife who shares her positive homebirth turned hospital birth story. 

After labouring for well over 20 hours at home, Emma was forced to come to terms with transferring to hospital. We chat about her experience of a publicly funded (ie. free) homebirth program, having a doula, her long labour, the emotional journey of accepting the need to transfer, and she also shares her powerful birth story, where despite having an epidural on board, she successfully goddess squatted baby Lua out! 

Resources: 

• Birth Time Documentry (get a 20% discount with code ' CICADA20 ' ) 
• Di Diddle Birth Education 
• Epidurals 
  • Cochrane Review 
  • Evidenced Based Birth Podcast Ep 
• Homebirth Victoria 

Chapters

• 1:00 Emma's Journey to Home Birth
• 5:48 The Decision for Home Birth
• 9:09 Connecting with Midwives and the Home Birth Program
• 14:55 The Labor Begins
• 18:00 The Role of the Doula
• 24:00 Transitioning to Hospital Birth
• 41:44 The Decision to Transfer to Hospital
• 52:00 Pushing with an epidural and the Birth Experience

Transcript

0:02

This is Birthing at Home, a podcast. I'm Elsie, your host. I'm a home birth mom of two little boys, a doula in Melbourne supporting birth at home. I'm a mental health nurse and the co-creator of Home Birth Victoria. If you want to learn more about me, the podcast or my work as a doula, check out www.birthingathome.com.au. Before we begin, I would like to acknowledge the Wurundjeri people who are the traditional custodians of the land I'm recording on in Nam, Melbourne, Australia. I would also like to acknowledge the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples have been birthing at home on country for tens of thousands of years prior to the British invasion and acknowledge that sovereignty has never been ceded. This is episode 61 and today I chat with Emma who is a student nurse and midwife who shares her positive home birth turned hospital birth story. After laboring for well over 20 hours at home, Emma was forced to come to terms with transferring to hospital. We chat about her experience of being in a publicly funded, i.e. free home birth program, having a doula, her long labor and the emotional journey of accepting the need to transfer. And she also shares her powerful birth story where despite having an epidural on board, she successfully got her squatted baby lure out. Enjoy this fantastic episode and please make sure to share or rate or review it so others can also find it. Welcome Emma to birthing at home a podcast. Hi, so happy to be here. Thank you for joining me on a very rainy Melbourne Sunday morning, especially because it was so hot yesterday. It's a bit of whiplash. That's Melbourne. I'm really excited because Emma, you're going to share today your transfer, home birth transfer story, which is a very much needed story to be put out there in the world. So I'm very grateful. Do you want to start by giving a bit of intro to who you are, who's in your family, that kind of thing? Yeah. So I'm Emma. I live in Melbourne with my husband, Tim, my now one year old Lua and our dog Zumi. You might hear my accent. I'm not Australian. I'm actually from the US originally. Basically my husband Tim is Australian. We ended up moving over here about five years ago. So it might be bit of a hybrid accent now, actually. And I guess just another thing to note about me that is relevant to my story is that I am in my final year of nursing and the degree. So yeah, I'm a student midwife, which definitely informed my journey of how I chose to birth as well. Yeah, amazing. And how old is Lua now? She's one. She was one last week. So, of course. Yeah. with a little of the watermelon cake. Of course. Such a crazy emotional milestone. The first birthday. So yeah, great time to share my birth story before I kind of forget all the details. I think I'm a bit afraid of that. Yeah. Well, this will, you know, solidify it in time somehow. So that was awesome. So I suppose in nursing in midwifery now. Growing up, like, I mean, how did you how did you go into the to the dual degree? Like, had you always wanted to work with birth? Like, what was your sense of pregnancy birth growing up? Like, what was that journey like? Yeah, I think I was always as a young person kind of drawn to mothers and babies like that mini mommy type child. And when I actually lived in Canada, I ended up doing on the side of kind of my work. postpartum dual life training, which kind of got me halfway down the rabbit hole, I guess you could say, of the birth world. And I guess I started to see a different side of birth. didn't really know about home births before as much about physiological birth, but that community kind of brought me in there a little bit. But I still wasn't completely immersed in birth like I am now. then, so Tanai used to work in performing arts. And then during the pandemic, was probably, you know, pretty much shut down. So I decided to go back and study. was like, midwifery is always something I've been interested in, always something I want to do. So I just enrolled and here I am. And obviously entering that degree took me completely down the rabbit hole. And yeah, I learned a lot more about physiological birth and midwifery education. And yeah, about what birth looks like in the system here. made me curious about what it looks like outside of it as well. Yeah. Yeah. And so growing up, obviously not in Australia, like, did you have an idea of home birth growing up or was it kind of only when you started to, I guess, like get into womanhood and like your postpartum doula stuff that you started to learn about home birth? Yeah, definitely. They're growing up. I didn't really know people that home birth no one in my family home birth. Yeah. the kind of medicalised birth myself or my mom with me is what I mean. So it's definitely when I kind of joined that did that postpartum dual training and started mingling with the natural birth community. amazing. And so what was your journey with Lua like in terms of pregnancy? Yeah, for getting pregnant. Yeah, I guess. Yeah. Yeah. So I was kind of kind of funny because I was in this phase of just trying to figure out my body in my cycles because my background being athletic and acrobatics, I kind of wacky cycles, long cycles, missed cycles. So there was actually kind of like a deep fear in me that getting pregnant might be something difficult or even not possible in the worst case scenario for me. So tonight I got married the summer before and I was kind of thinking about, maybe I should try and pay attention to my cycles. What's going on? Should I see a naturopath maybe and just try and get them more regular if I want to conceive? And we were also thinking when's the right time? We don't know. it now? Is it in a couple of years? And then before we could really think too hard, I fell pregnant. Yeah, yeah. It was... a relief in the sense that I was so grateful my body was capable of becoming pregnant quite easily. we very happy. Yeah. And so I just had like a very random memory because as many listeners probably know is that like Home Birth Victoria, like we have meetups and I'm just remembering that you brought Lua and you that's you came like weeks or something after she was born to like the one of the meetups. Yeah, that was the first meetup I came to. I was born in the house, but yeah, I didn't know where to go. And I was like, this would be a great place to get out of the house with my newborn where the chaos was welcomed. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I just had that red memory. And so once you become pregnant, was it always home birth? Like how did you? land upon home birth for yourself. Like what was, did Tim have any like preconceptions about like what home birth was? Yeah, actually, I think we had, I think since I was a couple of years into my midwifery degree, I had thought a lot about what I had wanted for myself through that time when I did fall pregnant. And yeah, I attended a lot of hospital births through my training and I guess a lot of things that I saw just kind of freak me out or didn't add up, which was, yeah, part of me just falling down the rabbit hole of birth. mean, probably a lot of people listening know exactly what I mean. You start to see a few things that don't add up to you. And I knew the full scope of what can happen at home and everything that could happen at home I was so comfortable with and didn't feel like the experience would kind of get swept up and led somewhere that I didn't want it to go. that's, and that's what I wanted for myself. I wanted to have physiological births. So I thought, yeah, homework is kind of the only, is where I want to start. And so the only thing I want for myself, so I, as soon as I felt pregnant, I got my referral sent to the publicly funded home birth program. I thought I'll try and get in there first. And if that's not possible, I'll go private midlife. But with me studying, was such a great thing to be able to access publicly funded number. Um, so that program right away. And that was, I knew how quickly you need to send your referral. So that was one benefit of being kind of in it as a student midwife. Yeah. Inside of knowledge. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And, um, what about Tim? Like did he, like, did he sort of go on a similar journey in like learning about you know, what happens in hospital and around that life, physiological birth, like vicariously through your studies. Yeah, I think so. I think that was part of it. also a couple years ago, I dragged him to birth time. Amazing. Yeah, he loved it. So it gave him another deeper or visual understanding of kind of what I've been talking about all this time. And as well, Tim's mom kind of had my vaginal birth and the birth center. yeah, he was kind of, she was quite supportive of our choices. And yeah, he just was like, I trust you and you know more about this than me. And I want you to have, as comfortable as possible in the experience. So, didn't need much convincing luckily. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's amazing. I do hear that quite often that yeah, when Like the woman has gone on that journey pre-pregnancy that yeah, vicariously like, yeah, through conversation and sharing stories, like even about like what you're witnessing, what you're seeing, what you're learning, like on placements and in assignments and stuff. I mean, student midwife life is kind of good in that way because you do have like access to the most up-to-date research and you are reading like what what is actually evidence-based. So to have that sort of background knowledge, I think is yeah, something that like, yeah, most women, because most women aren't like midwives, you know, don't have, and then being thrown into the world of home birth, it can be obviously quite a shock for the people around them. But I completely know Chimmy and I do feel for women during that overwhelming time when they haven't really thought about. their choices of their experience yet at all when I had already spent years thinking about it. It was clear what I wanted. But for most people, that's not the case. Yeah. And it's quite overwhelming to educate yourself, make choices kind of all at once, especially when, as I mentioned, to get into certain programs or to get a private midwife, you need to contact them or send your phone right away and you might not know what you want yet. Yeah, exactly. Know what you want or what even your choice is, like what even exists. That's where you're standing. Little plug. And so you got into the publicly funded home birth program. Did you have like any like initial like concerns about like any exclusion? criteria like, you know, cause I do know that they do like the 36 or something week check and like personally, I feel really, I wouldn't meet criteria now for those programs anyway, because my babies are too big, but like personally, like looking at the exclusion criteria, I feel really intimidated by it because like there's so many things like, did you have any of those concerns or how did you feel about that? Yeah, I definitely did. That is the downside of going to the publicly funded program, is it is a little more strict with that criteria. And I didn't know what to expect because obviously it was my first baby. So I hoped and expected to have a straightforward healthy pregnancy, but you just don't know. And I kind of, yeah, just said I'll cross that bridge when I get to it. I was prepared to maybe have to scramble and find out another solution. Fortunately for me, which I know is not the case for everyone, I didn't have to do that. I ended up staying. did not risk having the program. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I guess like at the end of the day, you have to weigh up like sort of pros cons with, with everything. And I mean, the fact that it's publicly funded is like a huge pro, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And so what was If you can remember like what was your experience or what was the process connecting with your midwives in that program? Like, did you have the same midwife or is it like a group of like midwives? Like how does how did that work for you? Yeah, I had so yeah, my midwife reached out and we met so I had a primary midwife that just worked in a team of two. And they just did like a one week on one week off. when I was gone, they covered. the case out of both of them. So I did just have contact with my primary midwife for most of the pregnancy. Then in third trimester, I did meet the alternate midwife who she worked with, who actually ended up being at my labor. But yeah, it was just one primary midwife, which was lovely. Yeah, amazing. Her number, to call or text her anytime. We had some appointments at clinic and some at home. Yeah. But yeah, I really can't fault the experience there. She was amazing and it such a lovely experience with her to have that relationship. Yeah, yeah. That's pretty interesting that they do. So they just alternate one week off, one week on. Yeah, and that's how they did it. And I'm not sure. I know different NPP midwives at different hospitals work in different ways, but that was their system. So it was pretty good because I would know, OK, like she's going to be on call this week. when it got to the end, at least I feel like, well, if my baby's born over the weekend, it'll be her. If it's born after Monday, it'll be the other midwife. Yeah, that was the system. Yeah. You know, that's actually pretty good, I feel, because otherwise then you have to try and suss out. I remember like when it was the lead up to Frankie being born, I was like asking midwives for their like rosters because I was like, when are your days off? And then yeah, like, I ended up going into labor or yet being in labor on my primary midwives day off. And so then I was like, well, like, who else is like around? And but yeah, if you have that predictability of like, one seven day period or whatever on one that's yeah, that's actually really nice. work-life balance. Yeah. Mind working like that one day, to be honest. Yeah, yeah, it doesn't sound bad to me either. And so in that program, or like, guess, just speaking generally to your pregnancy, did you like engage in any like sort of separate education or that preparation for labor, birth, like anything like that? Yeah, actually we did a little bit. So there's a woman called Di Diddle and she has like a birth preparation class where you can just go, it's like a series of four and you can just go to each one individually and buy each one individually rather than the whole one. So Tim and I did two of the ones that she offered, which was good because I felt like I was like, I can educate you about the physiology of birth at home and then we can go to the one after that, which was about kind of labor support and show some videos of birth. So we did do a little, it was nice because it wasn't like the full cost of a bigger birth preparation course. But he still got kind of immersed a little bit more and we got to practice some support techniques and went to one where re-adimsy also comes. Cool. feels just great. And I actually remember she was like, anyone here having a home birth? And we were the only ones that raised their hands. then we have a doula and we were the only one that raised our hand also. I think Tim felt pretty proud in that moment. Yeah. And she went on her whole thing about the statistics of, know, birth in hospital versus birth at home. Yeah. and physiological birth. Yeah. Yeah. So I think it like affirmed it and he's like, yeah, nice on baby. made a great choice. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. that's brilliant. and with like the, I know each publicly funded program is different, especially the newer ones, but with the program that you went through, like what kind of Like, I guess what I'm trying to say is, did they provide the birth pool? I heard that they provide the birth pool. Did that? We had to get paid deposit, not really rent. So, yeah, we just picked it up from the medical rental spot at the hospital and paid like a hundred dollars and then when we gave it back, we got that deposit back. brilliant. Yeah. So that was pretty good. think we might've bought a pool liner or something. Yeah. But otherwise, yeah, everything else was covered with the birth equipment. The midwife came and brought medications and left them in our fridge around 37 weeks at our house, the hemorrhage medications, and another medical company delivered oxygen. Um, for resuscitation. Well, that was just like chilling in our house for a couple of weeks. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's always like exciting though, when that stuff gets dropped off. Cause you're like, Oh, it's the time. Yeah. Yeah. So that was exciting, yeah, everything was, was done by the hospital, was really great. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Brilliant. And what, uh, I feel like I remember this from a previous conversation that I've had with you, what is like your sort of living situation. Do you live in like a unit or an apartment or? Yeah, we live in an apartment, city life, living on the 10th floor than an apartment. Yeah. Yeah. So it's so funny because I think at one point I was just like this fleeting thought and early pregnancy, can I have a home room here? I live in an apartment, like I don't live in this big house. And then I was like, What? Like, why would I think that? In the hospital, you're just in one room with a bathroom. Like, as if you need a whole house because getting a whole house when you give it to a hospital birth, and that's like the status quo. Yeah. It was kind of funny. There was our building does have an intercom and it's kind of annoying to get into. But I like assigned that role to my doula. I was like, well, the midwives need to come in. I taught her how to answer the buzzer and go down and let people in. Yeah, she did during the labor when my middle-aged did come. yeah, don't know. It was just a funny little anxiety. Like how people can find a parking? How are they going to get in? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I know when I had Murphy, we lived in an apartment and luckily there was like a big parking sort of like public parking spaces nearby. But yeah, like in the in, yeah. more like very built up areas. I imagine that that would be something that yeah, midwives would have to just like navigate somehow. Yeah, definitely. So, but yeah, we, worked out great. we have two bedrooms, two bathrooms and living room and we just set up, you know, every room as a different space and I'm also trained in the living room and the toilet. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah, brilliant. It was perfect. Yeah. And like in the lead up to labor with Lua, did you like have any like, like pre labor, like feelings like did you like anticipate like anything like? I don't know. I'm not making sense, but I think you understand what I mean. No, so I yeah, I had a pretty straightforward pregnancy other than just the average aches and pains and sickness in first weeks. I had a really bad sacroiliac pain actually in my third trimester to the point where I was kind of just waddling around at one point. And then it kind of went away like right that term. Well, it didn't go away. It got a lot better, I should say. was still painful. And I think it was because she had really dropped down into my pelvis and just taken a bit of pressure away. So that was kind of reassuring. That was kind of, yeah, right at turn, maybe 37, 38 weeks. So I was like, oh, she's, you know, or the baby, didn't know what gender she was at the time is maybe getting ready, but I was prepared in my mind to go to 42 weeks. So I was trying not to get too excited. And I knew statistically 40 plus five is the average for first time moms and I was like, okay, okay. That being said, as soon as 40 weeks hit each day did feel super long. And I remember the feeling that I had each night going to bed. I'd be like, please, maybe something happened tonight. And then each morning I'd wake up and I'd be like, nothing happened. Besides me getting up to toilet to pee like four times. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Nothing. So there was honestly not really signs until a few days before I started to slowly lose the mucus plug. But even then I was like, it still could be days, weeks, like this isn't really a definitive sign of anything. And then on the day of 40 plus five, I don't know what I did all day. Evening, we just were trying, think we're just trying to kill time at that point. I think anyone that's kind of over 40 weeks nose each day is this weird limbo where you're trying to kind of fill the time, but you can't too many plans because you might just have a baby at any time. So we went over to Tim's parents for dinner, had a curry, which we always joke like maybe it was the curry. But yeah, it was for sure not the curry. Got home that night and My water's broke. I was in bed and then I got up to the toilet and like, just had a huge, legit, Hollywood style sploosh, which was a surprise to me because I think that's how a lot of people think most labor start, but it's really not. No. Often it's a trickle or a lot of people's waters don't break at all. So I was like, oh, okay, of course I'm going to have that experience. The one from the movies. Yeah. Yeah. my carpet. And so I went to the toilet and then like, more was coming out and I was like, okay, like, my waters are well and truly broken now. Yeah, I think I texted my doula because I didn't want to text my midwives because I didn't want to be put on the clock for having erupted my waters. Yeah. I didn't know things were gonna actually start but I had all this like built up energy like, my gosh, something's starting I need to text someone so I text my doula. And that was exciting. but actually the labor ended up just starting only a few minutes later or- my gosh, that is exactly like the movies. I know, I know. I was just shocked. I was like, this is so funny. and yeah, it was, it started out, it was not like period cramps. I was kind of expecting a really slow early labor, on and off maybe 10 minutes or more apart, but that was not what happened. just like- got a contraction and I was like, okay, that was not a period cramp. That was kind of intense. You know, still manageable and it got a lot stronger, but yeah, it just started. Wow. Yeah, that night. So I think that was about, I don't know, nine or 10 o'clock when that kind of started. And then, then started a night that was just, I think the most beautiful part of my labor that first night. So things were still... not too intense. I was having more contraction probably every five minutes. I definitely was not able to rest or lay down or stay laying down when I was having a contraction. was kind of, I had to like assume position or be on all fours when they were happening. yeah, like I said, it was not period cramps or anything like that. So I was up, you know, the whole night, but it was Yeah, I think I just had this overwhelming excitement that night where I was just thinking, it's finally my turn. Like I've been at so many births. I've waited so long for this now to meet my baby. And it was nighttime. I had such a beautiful setup in our house, my little lights on. And Tim was up with me for the first bit because he was quite excited and just being with me, massaging me and stuff like that. And then at one point, you know, he didn't have. this adrenaline on board quite like I did. I like, I some sleep. But actually that period of time, a couple hours where I was just alone in a living room with my beautiful little lights and my music was just so nice. It was, yeah, it was, think, one of my favorite parts because it was still the beginning. I still had so much stamina. I was so excited, but I was ready for a marathon. So I was, and it just kept going at that pace all night. It didn't really slow down. It was just, Every five minutes in my mind, was thinking this is still early labor. think I did text my midwife and just say, I'm having a few contractions, but early days, I'll call you if anything picks up. I didn't have to that whole night. was still just, know, every five minutes in the shower, use the tense machine, just kind of trying to take it as easy as possible. But I was still vocalizing through all those contractions and yeah, it was so lovely. But it was surreal when, like when the sun comes up and you go, like every birthing person that's laid with her the night, no matter what intensity, the sun comes up and you kind of go, okay, I'm kind of tired. What's happening? Yeah. yeah, yeah. I was like, okay, just got to keep going. Ardula then came over, actually. Oh, geez. that's an angel. And she just made us food. She put some congee on the stove. She made me like the most delicious cacao. She sent it into the store like you walk the dog just to get some fresh air. And I think she had a little lay down as well. But she spent some time with me, helping me just move my body, massaging me, lots of bum jiggling, just feeding me, which was amazing. always think like don't even know if we would have eaten. If my duel hadn't been there, we would have eaten, but we were so well nourished. was such a nice reset too, because we're like, okay, we've done this first night, but obviously there's still a lot to go. So she came and just nourished us for a couple hours. And then things were just exactly the same the whole time, just five minutes, five minutes, five minutes. And then I did ask her, was like, okay, can you just help me do some classic also? acrobat me, was like, maybe just my body, I need to do some crazier things with my body to just get this baby in their position. So I had my birth sling and I was leaning into it. And we were doing a couple things, just trying to move my body, you know, sitting backwards on the toilet, doing leg up on my stools, lots of different stuff, just to see if I could get things along. I think then I was like, I need to be patient, but I kind of just want the labor to kick off now. Like I want it to be, I want to be roaring every two minutes because you know, that's going to get my baby out in these five minute leave contractions. I'm not really going to do that. And so during the day, it didn't like really slow down. just stayed the same. Yeah, it just stayed the same. So yeah, we just kept plugging through. My duo went home. midday, maybe because we were all kind of like, okay, it's not quite ready to be kicking off just yet. Just keep going. Just keep waiting. Meanwhile, I was still leaking waters, waters, waters. Yeah. Which I was like, oh, that's good. Like, every time I do something with my body differently, I'm like, hopefully they are coming down a little further. And that's gonna kick things off. And then finally, around, yes, sundown that night. So yeah, this was now like Sunday evening. So 20 hours or so after my letters had gone, things finally started to escalate. So it all became kind of a blur. I think I didn't even have the thought to be like, yes, it's happening because it was just once it's happening, once you're in that full active roaring labor, there's you're not really thinking about anything. It's kind of this like trip this bubble you're in. everything from there is a little bit blurry, but I think at one point I did say to Tim, like I want Ardula back. And then I think not long after that, also said, maybe I want the midwives. Yeah, because I was kind of feeling like, what if I give birth quickly? I don't know why I had this feeling. was like, maybe I'm gonna give birth. super quickly once things are on, which couldn't be further from the truth when you hear it. It's so funny. So, I feel so exhausted for you. Every five minutes for like 20 hours, more than 20 hours. I I was starting to get a little tired, but I was also like, okay, let's go. I think it really helped that I had prepared for a long labor. Like in my mind, I was like, you need to prepare, you're going to go to 42 plus weeks and labor for two days. Yeah. Because that's, that might happen. And it almost kind of did. was four weeks. Yeah. labor for two days. yeah. But yeah, that was very exciting that finally it was, you know, two to three minutes apart and it was really, you know, much more intense. was vocalizing before, but it looks like, okay, it's really on now. So at one point, yeah, my doula came back, my midwives came. I remember it was dark by then. So it must have been seven, eight o'clock or something by the time they came. I was in the bathroom when I do remember kind of people coming in and knowing that they were there. They came and said hello. And I do remember that. But I was just in there doing my thing, just roaring away. And then... I started to have such intense pain, no one really ever told me about, but down the front of my hips, kind of. And I was like, oh, that is just awful. And all I wanted was to get in the water. When that started, I was like, this is just so painful in the front here, down my legs, kind of. they started, Tim started filling up the bath or the breath pool. And then I think I got in there. 9pm or something after he made it too hot. And by the time I knew it was almost filled, I was desperate. was like, I want I need to get in there now. I had it in my mind like that's gonna help right now. I was just so irritated. And then I was like, how dare you make it too hot? He said you can't get in yet. You can't get in yet. It's boiling. Anyways, finally, he got enough cool water in there. And I got in which was such a relief. That did actually really help. I think things might have slowed down a little bit once I got in there, but they were still still happening. Yeah. And then I remember this moment. Well, actually, first I got the sensation was maybe around 10pm. I suddenly went, I push like, I have this pushy feeling. And at first it was kind of quite subtle and just kind of there. I didn't have to push but I could feel there was pressure. And then it got stronger and stronger. And my midwives were just like, yeah, like, you feel like you need to push just trust your body. I hadn't had any checks. didn't want to have any vaginal exams or anything. It wasn't part of my plan. So I just kind of did. I just let it, sensation be there and then I tried a couple of times just pushing with it. And then I remember Tim and I looked at each other at one point, we were so excited. We were like, are we glad to have our baby? We looked and we're like, do you think our baby will be born before midnight? Like will it be the 18th or the 19th? Or it be the 20th, so. And because it was Sunday night. And then, yeah, I guess another hour or more went by and then the sensation just got stronger and stronger and just so intense and more involuntary. I remember I was like. trying to kind of check myself. So funny kind of cringe in hindsight. I'm like, why was I doing that? But I tried to check myself, but I just couldn't. I couldn't feel myself properly. my mom was like, can you feel anything? And I was like, I don't know, I can't, I can't do it properly. And I don't know what I'm feeling. And they're like, okay, no worries, no worries. And then it just got so intense. And I was like, there was no signs. were kind of holding the mirror at one point like, can we see the baby or, but I just then kind of started to think, get in my head a little. was like, I don't think this is actually my baby coming out. And I think I said something like that and like a whiny, was like, what if it's not, it's not the baby just being born. And they were like, okay, let's just get out. Let's do something else. so we got out, went to the toilet for a while. and just did other little things in our circuit at home, kind of that we had set up. However, things got really escalated with that pushing sensation to the point where it was just so explosive and so intense, almost like the sensation of vomiting is still to this day how I describe it, that, you know, in your core, just that heaving. And I just then knew that it wasn't, yeah, this wasn't. second stage of my baby being born. just feels like something else. It doesn't feel productive, which when I actually then did push her out later, you know, I that confirmed that was not the same feeling. Yeah. So I kind of voice that to my midwives and they were like, okay, yeah. And honestly, it's a bit flurry else, but I'm trying to remember I did have vaginal check that I did ask for, but I'm trying to remember if it was then or a few hours later. Either way, we started what I call the Spain Baities Bootcamp part of my labor around then, which was probably around, I don't know, maybe close to 11 or midnight at this point. Wow. And thank goodness my midwife and a second midwife had come. I forgot to say that. So when I started pushing in the pool, they also thought like, okay, this girl's about to This is it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. called the second midwife and she had come in. I think that's why. And then I had that moment where I got excited because for a second I thought I'm about to have my baby. midwives are here. Anyway, so second midwife was also along with my, the primary midwife were both so knowledgeable about fetal glitching, spinning babies, stuff like that. So they had a little huddle, I think with my doula who also is a body worker and amazing with that stuff. And they were like, these are the things we're going to try. And they're like, are you up for it? I was like, yes, whatever. I'll do whatever, put me in any position. Like, get this pushing, stopping, because I was really struggling with the pushing. You know, it's one thing, just trying to get through the sensation, the painfulness of the contraction, but the pushing was more of a full body experience where it requires so much like strength in your core. And it was so exhausting. So I was like, let's go. versions, belly tilts, belly lifts. Tim was in there. Belly lifts for me. And then one of my favorite memories where I was just like, wow, midwives are amazing. My midwife was actually pregnant herself. She had a little bump. And we were just, I was sitting backwards on the toilet and she was just pulling me backwards into her for these pelvic tilts to see if that could help the situation for a while. And I remember just having this lucid moment where I was like, oh my gosh, can feel my midwives belly on my back. It's the middle of the night. She's just pulling me into her, doing the physical labor. She just wants me to have this experience so bad too. I really felt like they were just on my side, just trying to... It was a whole team, you There was the two of them, the doula, Tim, just cheering me on through every inversion. And I was... Yeah, pretty determined to do as much as I could. There was only one thing, the old flying cowgirl that I just could not. Like I just sprung up. I was like in the position waiting for the next contraction. As soon as it came, I was like, there's no way. I just got back on all fours. I couldn't do that one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But, you know, we gave it, gave it a shot and then we were okay with pushing with still just, just. explosive and I was just coping kind of less and less with that. And they were like, okay, okay, like, what should we try next? So we tried an in and out catheter at home. Yeah, just to see if emptying my bladder. We all like, they're like, have you peed? And I was like, I don't know. Yeah, I did once in the pool, you know, when you're an active. Yeah, you're like, I don't even know. I tried and I couldn't so they were like, okay, want to try this and just see if it can do anything in my mind. was like, yes, anything that's, you know, lower intervention that doesn't really have risks to the baby. Yeah. Like, let's try it. Like what effect did make the difference? So we did that. It was a bit tricky. remember laying on my back for even 30 seconds just felt like the worst thing in the world at that point. Yeah, we did that. We did a little bit. Unfortunately, didn't kind of work. then I think it was around 4am that we first started to all put transfer on the table. I think it was, it was a conversation like it wasn't my midwives really being like, I think we need a transfer, I think we need a transfer. We kind of just had this huddle and I was like, What do do? Like, I'm just feeling, I don't know if I can go on with this pushing, like it hasn't stopped. It's so, it got to the point where I kind of even couldn't move. Like every time I would even take a step, there would just be this intense pressure, like in my bum and my core just heaving, taking my breath away. And they were like, well, there's, you know, we could transfer if that's something that you want. So I was like, okay, let's, think about it. then Tim and I have a little chat. And I think in my mind at that point, I had already been thinking about it for at least an hour before then. I think this is probably going to need to happen soon if nothing kind of changes. I'm just feeling, yeah, I was just kind of at a breaking point, I guess, with that pushing sensation. And I felt like we had tried so many things. to get the baby in a better position. I think I was aware in my midwife brain that this sensation of pushing was my baby being in a position that wasn't optimal for either of us and something I needed to shift. And then yeah, Tim and I had a little cry together because it was not what we wanted and it was disappointing. The heart rate on intermittent auscultation had always been fine and we knew that. So we weren't transferring with her distress on the babies part or anything like that. And yeah, we just made a decision. We're like, yeah, we're ready. I think we need to go in and see if there's anything else we can do in the hospital. And in my mind, I knew that was an epidural probably because we weren't going into the hospital to do more spinning babies. We had already done five hours of that at home. So we were like, okay. So it's just a very calm, like packing up and making my way slowly with my, because every step was just so awful at that point to the elevator and then down to Tim's car. then, well, when I say calm, mean, like there was no emergent rush, but I was still screaming every single time, every two minutes. I was like... know, if anyone's ever had to even go to the hospital for a planned hospital birth when they're in that kind of foreign labor, you're like doing the math in your head suddenly. You're like, okay, we've got like 60 or two minutes between or whatever. How can I like make it there because I can't be having it's a four in the morning. I can't be I want to get to the car before the next contraction. So I did have that kind of insight to like, really does. is a downside of playing hospital birth, how you have to do that, like go to the hospital and you're already like this because that was awful. Yeah, we got in the car, I was like, on all fours in the front seat just roaring and Tim was just having the most, the worst drive of his life. like, drive swiftly but safely. In my midwives went in their car and followed. And yeah, I guess the benefit of the transfer in this publicly funded program was the midwives did do work for the hospital at the hospital. there was no like handover to the hospital from the midwives. It was just kind of like a continuation of care. my midwife was there and put a candle in me. So that was really nice that I kind of felt. safe there, wasn't really many new people didn't come in like no one came in and bothered us. We just got set up. I was just laboring away. And as I said, we knew we were going in there to try, see if the epidural would take away the sensation to push, which would just pain for you so much. Cause you know, that's everything I didn't want, but I had kind of switched my view on it at that moment and just be like, okay. this, we're trying this, we're using it as a tool. It doesn't mean you're too weak or you couldn't do it. We're just gonna see if it can help this situation of stopping pushing. Yeah. Because I was starting to, well, I think I forgot to mention, but I did have one more vaginal exam at home before we left. the midwives did ask, do you wanna just do one more just to make sure your baby's not coming out right now? And I was like, yeah, you know what, let's just do that because what if I was suddenly just in transition, that would be just silly to transfer. They didn't tell me, they never told me through the labor how dilated I was. didn't really want to know. And they also had the mindset of we don't really care either. It doesn't really matter. Like you could be three now and 10 in 10 minutes. Yeah, yeah, doesn't it's not really giving us that much information. It's only giving us information if we know, you know, your baby's about to be born. Yeah, actually. Yeah. So I knew that she wasn't about to be born because I didn't say anything. So we did continue with the transfer. And yeah, in hospital that I think by around six a.m. I had an epidural on board. and only worked on one side, which I was so happy about. Actually, like, I know people want that full relief, but I was so scared of the... Numbness?...releasing that control and not feeling what was happening in my body because, you know, and at that point I wasn't afraid of bit of pain because I'd already been in labor for days. Yeah, yeah, It wasn't like, yeah, I was like, well, that's fine. I at least can feel my body still kind of going and what's happening. So that was a relief because... Otherwise I really did not like the sensation of feeling a bit heavy. And I just tried to keep it the lightest block that I could because I didn't like that sensation. I did, guess, rest a little bit. I didn't sleep or anything because I was still feeling what was happening. And then within about two hours, I think I was not pushing anymore. I still was like doing the involuntary pushing that whole time. And when I got back to the door, I could still feel my body just still. Yeah. So that was, guess, a relief. I was like, OK, at least I'm not doing this pushing anymore because that was just so wild and unbearable. And then, yeah, we just waited for a couple of hours. I did have a slight bit of augmentation. but again, I'm so grateful being, having aligned midwives because also my student midwife brain, was like, yeah, we're gonna put that at, half, like I didn't want to tie it right at that exactly what the policy had said. I knew exactly what the policy said, but I was like, we're not going up every, you know, 30 minutes. I was like, I want longer. want slower titration because, Yeah, I've seen a lot of babies going to quite the stress with augmentation. So yeah, something I was aware of. was kind of like trying to preserve the experience. yeah, my mood, I was, also trying to do that with me. I've kind of like, okay, even though this is not plan A, like we still are fighting for the next best outcome. So I was trying to keep my spirit alive thinking that because course, was so much fear when we transferred. Like on me and Tim's part, I was thinking, you know, I'm transferring to the hospital with a potentially malpositioned baby. Like, what's going to happen? Is this going to be, you know, everything I didn't want, an instrumental birth or a cesarean? Let's, you know, still try and do everything we can to have us close to the experience that we wanted, even though we know it's not going to be the home birth that we wanted. So that's what we did. And then I started shaking at one point, probably like midday or a little before, this my whole body pelvis. And I just knew, I was like, this is like my body going through transition, which is weird sensation to not be going through it kind of mentally since I didn't have the full sensation. But my body still clearly was going through having so much adrenaline from that pelvis. opening all the way. And so I kind of was like, I'm gonna stop, like, let the epidural wear off altogether now, for as long as possible, a couple hours, hopefully, so that I can have as much sensation as possible to push my baby out. And so when, when you say that, what does that mean? Like, do they remove the epidural? Or they turn it off? Or like, how does how does that work? So it was, and in most hospitals that I've seen birth, it's a PCA. So you, they give you like a first a loading dose of the nicetus and then afterwards it's just a button that you press that kind of tops it up. So if you don't, if you stop pressing it, the block will become weaker. Like not to say you'll get full sensation back and be walking around the room in two hours, but you will start to get more. sensation as you do stop pressing. that was kind of my plan. I knew I wasn't going to be getting up and going back in the shower or anything, but I did not want to have a heavy block for pushing my baby out. Cool. I to able to move around as much as possible. So I did that. And then I had a check at one point because then I was, I did have the epidural, I had the CTG on, I was getting vaginal check so I was kind of in that process. Unfortunately, so the other midwives were like, oh yeah, you're fully dilated and we'll just, we'll wait a little while, we'll check again in a while, we'll give you time. And I think I just kind of pushed it out, pushed it out a little bit because I was thinking I want to try and keep having this epidural wear off as much as possible. So luckily, by the time you the process is like you check and then you can give X amount of time of passive descent. But I guess we were all aware of how that works. So we were trying to kind of time things in our favor. And yes, about the time I did start pushing, I did have a lot of sensation back, which was great. And I hope if anyone here listening can take something out of this mid to end up in hospital birth and know someone that's having a hospital birth that ends up with an epidural either by choice or using it as a tool the way that I did that they know that they can use it the way they want because I think there's not a lot of education around that. think people just think, okay, you get the epidural and the care does completely change. Don't get me wrong. And that's just because of the policies in hospital. The care is completely different after an epidural. But if If you have to have one for any reason, you know, you can control it a bit and keep it weak and let it wear off so that you have a little more control over your body. That really helped me and I'm grateful I had that knowledge. So yeah, by the time it was quote unquote, time to push. Because I didn't quite have, you know, it's funny. I all these hours pushing and pushing and then. I didn't really have that involuntary actual push my baby out feeling until I started pushing and then she was kind of lower, you know, coming through the birth canal and then became like more explosive and I could feel it a lot more. But the first few pushes, I was like, okay, we're just trying to push because I've been fully dilated for X amount of time. you know, that's how it works there in the hospital. But I did and it was actually pretty successful. was kind of kneeling. You know, put the whole head of the bed up and I was turned around just with one leg up, kneeling and then would every few push attempts I would just change which leg was up, try and move as much as possible. I was using the mirror, which was awesome. And I forgot to say, we did call my student midwife. I did have a continuity student midwife. Oh, brilliant. had to take forward. Yeah, you do. You do. Yes. She had been on a night shift when we were laboring at home. And so we thought, she's probably not going to make the birth. But since it took so long, she'd already gone home, had a nap, and then she was able to come to the birth. So good. So yeah. And then I think I, pushed once it kind of got going. I felt like I could really feel what was happening. I could feel when I was having my contractions and oh, the CTG. mean, it just just not my favorite thing. Anyways, it was just so surreal to have it on me because I was like, I just hate this thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was wrong. Also, I was like, it was showing that I was having surgeries at certain times. And I just looked at my midwife and I went, that's wrong. And she's like, Yeah, yeah, just listen to your body. If you can feel it. What is it saying? That's not happening. I could feel when I was having a contraction and I was able to. push with that and work with my body. And then I could see her coming in the mirror. That was so amazing. Also watching her come. And then, yeah, when her head kind of came, I just don't know what came over me, but I just needed to stand up with my body knew exactly what position needed to be in to get her out. And I just stood up and just grabbed the head of the bed and just kind of sat back like I was sitting in a chair. Wow. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And yeah, it's just one of those moments where I'm really grateful I had that. I'm like, even though I didn't have, you know, the physiological breath I wanted, I'm glad that my body was still somewhat in tune. And yeah, if you listen to your body, it just does know exactly what to do. That was not conscious thought at all. And in fact, I don't really think it's even recommended to like, in the bed when you have still an epidural. So you also had the CTG on and were you also hooked up to an IV? Yeah, I was. That's brilliant. I think it might have been detached by that point. I think I'm just thinking like, imagine if like the stuff like other stuff came in and then saw this woman, know, effigy or CTG, maybe Ivy, like just up on the back of the bed, like goddess, squatting her baby. Yeah. Just like an animal trying to like get of my... You can't contain me! Even this epidural can't contain me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No one said anything, obviously, like my baby was coming out and I things have been detached by then. cause I'm going to say even what I've seen as a student midwife and things are like when the baby's coming, sometimes midwives are like, let's just detach this and let's just take it Yeah. There's no point. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like the baby's about to be born. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that was happening. And then, yeah, her like head came and I remember think like being like, there's no way I can just. rest here. Like, I was like, I'm just gonna keep pushing. Like my body was just like, get her out, get her out. Like, I don't know, I've seen some beautiful births where the head is born. And then there's like, three minutes between, or two minutes between contractions. And the woman's just there with like the head out. And she's just breathing. And I was that was not me at all. was like, yeah. And they were like, do you think And then, yeah, so then I just pushed in her body came out in the next push when I was kind of standing there and my student midwife actually was the one that kind of received her. There was no way, as much as I would have loved to receive my own baby in the position I was in, was no way that was going to happen. Yeah, standing and bracing. so, my daughter just kind of... splooshed into my suited midwives hands and there was another huge catch of water, a sheet cotter. And then, you know, had that awkward moment that you just babies in between your legs and you have to like turn back around and sit. Which is so funny and like awkward and even with there was a couple things attached to me on like a homebreath. So that was even more kind of funny. Yeah, maybe it's all slippery. But yeah, I just looked at her and I was like, my gosh, like she's so cute. And we didn't know if it was a girl. And then I kind of sat back, looked and then I was like, it's a girl. Which was funny because I thought she was a girl the whole time. Wow. And yeah, she was so, yeah, so adorable. And I was just so relieved in that moment. It's crazy. Yeah, the relief after a baby was born. Whoa. And so how how many hours do you say that you were in labor? But like from like whenever you count it from when she was born, how long do you say? You know, I say from when I just had that first contract because it was from like five minutes. And I know like active labor is technically two to three minutes, which was probably about 20 hours of that active, active labor. But the whole labor started to finish, which never fully stopped at all. There might've been a few times where there was like seven minutes between or a slight little, was, yeah, I guess like 40 something hours. Cause it started at like eight or something, eight or nine PM on the Saturday and she was born at 3 PM on the Monday. So it was a journey. And like many first labors, it's always gotta be that first baby that just pushes you. Yeah, your body's never done it before. I know. Yeah. It's tough. think, like looking from a student midwife perspective, that would have been so good for the student midwife because she could count that catch. Whereas if it was at home, she wouldn't have been able to count the catch. Yeah, that was redemptive. Yeah. This is great. Like my student midwife has, I've helped her along in her education. Just like so many women have helped me. So I was. I was kind of triumphant that my student midwife was got to be there and got to receive. Yeah. That was good. And so in the room at the time there was your two midwives. So it's just one of my group practice midwives. Yeah. It was just there supporting the care and then the midwife in charge usually kind of. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So then and then my student midwife and me and Tim. Yeah. And, but you're not your doula. So yeah, I forgot to mention earlier, my amazing doula when we did transfer, we did decide that she would kind of her role would be to stay home and like clear our house of the home earth. Cool. help out with that. I don't know why we all made that decision, but it just felt right at the time. Yeah. She's been with us already for a long time as well. So she did that and she was so amazing. Like when we got home, it was like totally cleaned up and she had left these sticky notes all over the house on the mirrors, on the windows saying like, you're amazing, baby. You're a badass. And I just burst into tears when I saw them. When we got home, was like, I think I actually said like, just, want to like, was sad it was over actually. I want to go back. I want to do it again, even though it wasn't the homework we had planned in the moment. Of course, is grief there that that didn't eventuate, but I still would do it again, even if it ended up the same. I did really enjoy my labor and birth, and I just felt so loved and supported. My doula was amazing. The mood life was great. Tim was great. I was being... spoon fed apples with honey on them in the pool. A little goddess the whole time. So that's exactly what everyone wants in their labor. So I really, you know, can't fault that. And looking back, I think I don't have any like, question in my mind of what it was that prevented us from having a home birth. Of course, I do wonder, you know, what if we had waited one more hour? What if we had done one more inversion or? something like that, but I think I never feel like it was because I was scared or unsupported or I didn't have the right preparation or the right care because I feel like all those things were exactly on point and exactly what I wanted. do feel like there was something about my pelvis and my body and my baby that was not working together like it should. Yeah. But yeah, we'll never know, you know, when a breath doesn't go to plan. But eventually, eventually, like eventually, it did. Yeah, like it did. It did. Yeah. Yeah. And it was just that. Yeah, like that's yeah. I mean, you don't get to control when your body starts labor. You don't get to control when your waters spontaneously break. And when you've got that happening. first, and then you're having like this movie moment where like it's straight into labor, like, yeah, I think you should be really, really proud of yourself because that like, like, like I said, I was already feeling exhausted for you, like, you're only halfway through. And then to have such a powerful experience where you felt like that, you know, you had the power to make decisions, know, sure, it's not how you imagine, but you still had some control over your hospital experience and then the continuity of care. yeah, I, I, I feel really. Yeah, like, I guess, like, there's not many transfer stories out there. And I suppose, like, when I think about. If I had to. make that decision to transfer. I think that if I had had the experience that you had had, sure, grief at, you know, you know, not being able to have what you had hoped for. But I think it's really positive from from an outsider perspective. I think the experience that you had was really positive. yeah, I just I think like Do have any pictures of like that goddess of that score on the bed? Because like, what could be more powerful than that? Like you're just like, have one photo, but I think you nailed it when you said, yeah, I was still kind of in control in the sense that I still feel like when we showed up to the hospital, I still, I had to kind of tell myself to stay in this mindset because it was hard. think when things don't go your way, sometimes you just want to be like, well, know, it like. this is not what we wanted. Just go with whatever they want us to do. But I think that really helped me achieve an experience that I can frame as positive, ongoing that I showed up and we were still like, okay, like what can we still do despite the situation? How can we still make it as good as we can? Yeah. And I think that came from me and Tim and a combination of you know, midwives that were aligned with us that kind of got it. yeah, I that's my takeaway. And that home birth is, it was very humbling. Don't get me wrong. In my, you know, here I was like, well, if people just do the right preparation and have the right care, things will just be, you know, fine and the baby will just be born. And that's, that's not always the case. there's, you know, lots of other people that have had transfers as well, positive and less positive as well. But actually coming to the home birth Victorian meetup that first time postpartum was also very healing for me because I was like, okay, I can still identify as a home birther because it really is just a way of thinking whether or not your baby was actually born at home or not. Everyone that chooses a home birth that goes into it goes into it for usually a number of reasons, like the same reasons. A lot of times that works out and that's Amazing. And I hope that'll be my experience next baby. Yeah. The times that it doesn't, you can still identify as a home birth or for those reasons, you know? Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And it makes me so sad that, yeah, like I hadn't even thought of it. Like even like reaching out to publicly funded home birth programs being like, hey, like Home Birth Victoria exists. And then like, one midwife came back and said, like, we just didn't know whether to promote it, like whether women from publicly funded home birth programs were like, welcome. I was like, everyone's welcome. That makes me so sad. And then to also hear a similar thing with like transfer, like mom sort of transferred like, yeah, like it's home birth is the values. Like, yeah, like you said, people that choose to have home birth don't do it like just on a whim, just cause like, you know, like it's a very intentional choice to plan and have a home birth. yeah, if you're in Victoria, if you're in like, if you're listening, wherever you're listening, I don't, I really don't think there would be any home birth groups that Well, I freaking hope not that would exclude women that had, you know, chosen to or had to transfer. So I'm really grateful that you've shared your story and I'm really happy that you feel comfortable to come along to the meetups because, yeah, your story is really valuable as well because it like shows that you can still have a vaginal birth. It's like, you know, I think transfer stories are sometimes painted in that way. You know, the few that are out there. That yeah, once you enter into the hospital, your power is like kind of stripped away and you sort of just get pushed along this conveyor belt and you know, but that doesn't really sound like that was your experience. So I think that's yeah, a fantastic, fantastic story and lots of lessons. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. Do you have anything even like Yeah, thinking about like the processing of all of this in, you know, the past almost a day, 12 months. Do you have anything like to add or that you wanted to say or mention? You don't have to, but. think I said most of it already, but yeah, that home birth is a mindset. Everyone that's out there that's had a transfer. I see you. If there is grief there that we didn't have, you know, birth that we planned for and no matter how your birth ended up, I know other people have had transfers and have not had as positive stories as the one I'm sharing today. So yeah, I see you guys and I worked so hard for that birth though and I hope that pays away for my next birth. That is like, I guess the triumphant part of it for me that I'm like, okay, you know what? And someone said to me, they're like, well, how lucky is your next baby, you know, that you worked so hard to choose that vaginal birth, paving the way for them. I'm like, you what, you're right. Like, I can frame it like that and see another positive out of it in that sense as well. But yeah, next baby will be born at home. That's awesome. Thank you so much, Emma. All right. Thanks, Elsie.