First time mum chooses wild pregnancy & freebirth || Bronnie's birth of Abigail at home (Victoria)

Episode 38 is a first time mum freebirth story from Bronnie in Melbourne. Bronnie shares how she grew up petrified to be pregnant but after a lot of self discovery and unlearning, she set her intention to freebirth her first baby. In this episode we talk about the mental and emotional work that goes into planning a freebirth, healing, media shaming of social media freebirth communities, and then her quick, intense birth with baby Abi, and how birth has changed her . I’m also excited to say that Bonnie also shares her placenta smoothie recipe! 


Connect with me, Elsie, the host :)

www.birthingathome.com.au

@birthingathome_apodcast

birthingathome.apodcast@gmail.com

Don't forget to check out the May sponsor https://letstalkbirth.au/ and use ELSIE15 to get 15% off 

Resources: 

• Skin to skin https://www.breastfeeding.asn.au/resources/skin-skin-contact
• Cabbage Leaves for engorgement https://milkygoodness.com.au/blogs/news/cabbage-leaves-fact-or-fiction
• The Freebirth Society https://www.freebirthsociety.com/

CHAPTERS

00:00
Introduction and Background

03:20
Overcoming Fear and Embracing Free Birth

10:29
Unlearning and Healing

13:48
Holistic Living and Preparation

26:41
The Birth Process and Trusting the Body

30:00
The Onset of Labor

31:00
Preparing for Birth

32:18
Entering the Birth Pool

33:15
The Birth Process

36:09
Welcoming the Baby

40:18
Postpartum Challenges

45:30
Postpartum Recovery

52:59
The Transformation of Motherhood

58:35
Empowering Women to Trust Their Bodies

Chapters

• 3:20 Overcoming Fear and Embracing Free Birth
• 26:41 Holistic Living and Preparation
• 33:15 The Birth Process
• 45:30 Postpartum Recovery
• 58:35 Empowering Women to Trust Their Bodies

Transcript

0:03

You're listening to Birthing at Home, a podcast. I'm Elsie, your host. I recorded this episode on unceded war and drill land in Nam, Melbourne, Australia, where Aboriginal peoples had been birthing at home on country for thousands of years prior to the British invasion. They are the original storytellers. If you want to learn more about me, the podcast, or how I can support you in achieving your home birth, be sure to check out my Instagram at birthingathome.com. Underscore our podcast. Episode 38 is a first time mom free birth story from Bronnie in Melbourne. Bronnie shares how she grew up petrified to be pregnant, but after a lot of self discovery and unlearning, she set her intention to free birth her first baby. In this episode, we talk about the mental and emotional work that goes into planning a free birth, healing, media shaming of social media free birth communities, and then her quick, intense birth with baby Abby and how birth has changed her. I'm also excited to say that Bronnie also shares her placenta smoothie recipe. If you live in Victoria, please check out Home Birth Victoria network on Facebook and Instagram for all things home birth in Victoria, including monthly meetups. And don't forget to check out my website birthingathome .com .au. Welcome Bronnie to Birthing at Home, a podcast. Hello, thank you for having me. Thank you. I am excited to finally hear your story, Bronnie, for the listeners that obviously don't know. I actually met Bronnie when she started coming to the home birth Victoria meetups while she was pregnant. And now it's almost 12 weeks since she had her free birth with her first baby. but before I give too many details away, Bronnie, do you want to introduce yourself? Like give a bit of details about. who you are, where you're located, who's in your family? Yeah, yeah, for sure. So I'm Bronnie. I've got my little two month old Abs here and my husband, Sean. We're in Melbourne, Victoria in the Northern suburbs. And yeah, we just live a pretty like holistic, low -tox life and now there's a baby in the mix. So trying to figure that out too. Yeah. Has that always kind of been your lifestyle at low -tox, like holistic kind of living? No, it was a gradual progression to where we've got to now. My husband, however, he's a chiropractor. So he's always been very going against the grain. So when we connected, we both delved further down the rabbit hole, I would say. Yeah. Yeah. So obviously, I've already said that you had a free birth, but you know, reflecting on your own like childhood, adolescence, you know, pre-pregnancy or pre going down the rabbit hole. Did you have like many ideas about pregnancy and birth? Yeah, my, I was petrified to get pregnant. I did not want to have a baby because to me having a baby equaled pain and hospitals and I was petrified and I have not had a very good history myself with the system in hospitals. I've had multiple surgeries when I was a child. I've been like your typical person to live on antibiotics and go to the doctors every other week. So for me, birth was just not something I wanted to do. I also didn't have a very good welcoming into the world. My mom, you know, was told that her hips were too small and she couldn't birth us naturally. So we were C -section, forceps. She was told we couldn't breastfeed. just basically the whole cascade of events ended into my childhood. having illnesses and things. So yeah, it wasn't until again, like four or five years ago, maybe five years ago that I was like, I'm getting off the pill. And then that kind of got the ball rolling into everything else. So. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And do you remember, you know, when you first like, learnt much about home birth or free birth? Yeah. So we were trying to figure out the timeline last night and I think it was about maybe two and a half, three years ago, we were like, we want to have kids. And this at this point, we had already gone down a bit of a like low tox route. Yeah. And I was like, but I can't go to a hospital. Like, I just can't do that. So it was about year two and a half years ago, we found home birth. And that's what we were going to do. We're like, okay, that's what we're going to do. We're going to have a home birth. And the more that I started to look into home birth and the system and how it is more difficult, even if you are having a home birth. doesn't always mean that things are gonna go the way you want. It was like a gradual progression to get to free birth. And I didn't even know what that like I didn't even think home birth was a thing. Like when I heard home birth, I'm like, what do you mean you can have a birth at home? You don't have to go to a hospital. Like, my mind was blown. And then when I saw a free birth for the first time, I was like, what do you mean you don't have to go to a hospital at all? Like no system, no one involved. Like it was just like a complete rabbit hole at that point. So. Yeah, maybe about two years before we even conceived, we had gone down the rabbit hole of learning everything we possibly can about the body, birth, babies, the systems to prepare me for when I was pregnant. And even then, I don't think it prepared me. Yeah. And, you know, whilst you're going on this journey, like, did the people around you kind of change, like in terms of like your community and... connections. Yeah, it was like, it was all around the time of COVID as well that really sped up. I guess our values and our way of thinking and I definitely lost a lot of friends. I had a lot of comments made to me like, well, good luck with your birth or good luck with that or that's not going to happen or you're going to be lucky if that happens. Lots of comments like that. Yeah, even around the way we were living, you know, like I went through a whole overhaul of myself and my diet and I did a whole gut protocol to fix my gut health and like only drinking filtered water, no plastics, no perfumes, no chemicals in the house, like even those little things I was judged very harshly on. So when it came to me talking about home birth, I think for a lot of the people around me who had children who may have had traumatic births were obviously scared for me. It would have been nice to just have, my god, amazing, like, let's see how you go. It was. Good luck with that. You know, so yeah, when I got to the free birth conversation, it was like, just be careful about who you talk to. And then by the time I was pregnant, I was like, I don't care what anyone says. I don't care what anybody says. I just want to have my birth. And if people have anything that they want to say about it, then that's their problem. Yeah, that's kind of the way. Is there any like, was there any particular like resources or anything that? you know, how would you feel confident in birthing at home? Yeah, so one account that I followed, she had a wild pregnancy and a free birth. And this is when it was just getting introduced to me. And I remember I watched the video and she had edited most of it, but put her video up of her birth. And I was like, my God, I'm doing that. That's exactly what I'm doing. And then from there, I followed her account. She had a few doula friends that she followed. And all of a sudden I was immersed in this Instagram world of Birthkeepers and Free Birth and all things to do with system and birth. I actually smashed like maybe a hundred plus episodes of the Free Birth Society podcast. Wow. Yeah. Way before my pregnancy and then all during my pregnancy. And then many other podcasts I listened to like the Great Birth Rebellion and things like that. So it was all that we actually did the Free Birth Society course. They do a course. cool. They release it every year. And we did the whole thing. We bought it before I was even pregnant. But to be honest, I didn't feel like I learned a lot from it. It's a very philosophical course. You still learn a bit, but it wasn't anything I didn't already know if anything, it just re -embedded in me like you can do this type thing. Yeah. Interesting. I have a great online community of women who have done this and only maybe a handful of friends in real life that have actually, I don't even think I do. Everything's kind of been online. which is crazy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's, yeah. Well, I mean, yeah, we met because like I had also had that experience that even Home Birth, which, you know, is it, it's wild, not mainstream at all, but like, like just, yes. The face to face connections. I have so many more friendships that are like, face to face now than I ever have because yeah, it's all existed online. And I think there's many, especially at the media and whatnot, like shaming that, you know, these communities online, but like, that's just how it is. Yeah, that's just the way of the world. That's the way we're going. That is, yeah. What did you think we were going to do when you locked us up for two years? Like not talk to anybody, we had to connect somehow. Yeah, so I feel like people think like COVID was the worst time like lockdowns was the worst time and it really was but in another way for me, it really opened up my eyes to so much and really put me into the space that I'm in now where I'm just like, well, I am my own authority and I look after myself and I take that on myself and I don't know, I feel like more powerful than I think I ever have. It's probably because I pushed her out of me but you know, yeah, yeah, yeah, take it what you will. when you so you that's interesting what you say about the free birth society course because I heard multiple moms say that they did that course and I've read that people have done this course and whatnot. In terms of like. You know, did you feel like you had to prepare? In. I don't know if I want to say mental, but prepare in a way for. possibilities that might've been not physiological. Yeah, for sure. Absolutely. Or might've been like a variation. And like what sort of like resources, I guess, did you seek for that? Yeah. So there's a whole, you have to unlearn everything you already, you thought you knew. So that in itself, like was really hard to get to that point. But during the unlearning, you learn, what is an emergency or another variation of normal. So while you're unpacking everything, you don't just learn what, you know, what the issue is. You learn how to see what the issue is going to be, because there are signs and symptoms and things like that before the issue actually arises. So for me, or my husband in particular, because he's a chiropractor, he doesn't just look at the issue, he looks at everything around it that could potentially cause that issue. So very early on, we learnt potentially what some of the risks were in childbirth itself, and what to look out for, and then how to manage that or how to potentially avoid those things. So we put a lot of work and effort into my nutrition, and my body and the environment before we even became pregnant to actually avoid a lot of the things that can come about. And for the handful of things, and I mean, we had a handful of things that we would transfer for. we knew what to look for before they happened. And if they happened, we had a plan B. But to be honest, I didn't even have like, I didn't even write a hospital plan or anything, because I was so confident it was going to be fine. I was like, no, we got this. And if I have to go to the hospital, then I'll just say no to whatever I want to say no to. And I will be strong. And I don't know, I probably should have had a backup plan just in case because you never know. But, you know, I just I don't know, something in me just knew. But again, we were very aware of, you know, like if it's a cord prolapse, what do we do in my head? I was like, I get down, head down, bump up, go to the hospital, try not to push until we get there. Like I had plans in my head and we had discussed it just in case these things happened, but yeah, nothing did. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's also I really love that you didn't write a plan for hospital because even obviously I had a home birth with midwives, but like even then, Like I remember talking to a colleague one day and he was like, so have you packed a hospital bag just in case? And I'm like, no, because I'm going to be having this baby at home. And cause it is a mental thing. You really have to be like, yeah, I felt like I was, yeah. Yeah. I felt like if, if I had, you know, this list, the hospital, then I was already giving into the idea that like, you know, I get you. So yeah, I'm on the same wavelength with that. The unlearning though was a lot, like I'll be honest, you know, and I really truly, when I say COVID, I think changed my life like that period. It really led me into when I was pregnant and the unlearning because I, by that point already trusted myself. Like by that point, you know, things had proven to me what, like what the world was and what I was and I didn't. I was like, okay, well, that's just my body can do it. And this is just what my body does. And that's it. So I wasn't, it was more, I'll, I'll touch on this. The hardest thing I feel like leading into my pregnancy and my pregnancy was actually healing from my own family lineage, my own family trauma, my mother wound, that emotional side of it for me was far harder than any system. What what my body can or can't do. Like I was so determined that I was going to do it and I can do it, but it was, what if I'm going to be like, like my mom? What if I don't break cycles? Like that whole part for me really, really like took its toll. I turned into a different person going through all of that stuff. It was hard. Yeah. Yeah. I went to a lot of like mother groups, like mother circles, women's circles and... Like I did a few like online things with some women that was called like healing your mother wound because you don't realize what you take on from previous generations and even the way that you're coming into this world. Like you don't realize how you take that on. Instinctively, like I had a terrible bringing into this world and I obviously carry, you carry that with you. That's trauma you carry with you. So I was like, how do I? not do this to my child. And because I didn't know what I was having, I thought, God, if I have a girl, like I'm not ready for a daughter. Like I can't, I need a boy. I'm not ready for the girl. I'm not healed enough from that. I can't have a girl. And it was a girl. They gave me exactly what I needed, I think, to heal. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's pretty powerful. Like, Yeah, I think. Yeah, I mean, I mean, I have so, so many thoughts for fear of like offending too many people, but like I, I truly believe that, you know, the way a bit like I just like I know some people, right. And I don't think they're going to listen to this podcast. I hope not. But, you know, they chose, to have an elective caesarean and at however many weeks, like 35 weeks or something because of this, of the particular pregnancy, right? And, you know, I've, I received like a message the other day and like the babies are in, there's, they were twins. The babies are in these plastic boxes. Right. And I just I mean, I could be completely wrong. I could be completely wrong. But I've received four photos, right. And they're beautiful, beautiful. So little, beautiful. But they're they're in these plastic. I know I'm using the wrong term, but boxes like they're, you know, like they're they're cribs. Yeah. But like because of the oxygen, like, you know, it keeps things regulated, whatever. And I just thought. have they been held by their mom and dad? I know. I see videos on Instagram of like, my God, the baby's moving and rolling already, but the baby is rooting, looking for the nipple, but they're in their little cubicle and the parents are filming them from two meters away. And I'm like, go pick up your baby. And I get really upset. It just breaks my heart. Yeah. Like I'm always crying, just, just thinking, because like in, in my experience and yes, in a different, you know, only had one baby, obviously, but I love hearing twin free births. But you know, I understand it's not for everyone. But like, you know, I was the first person to touch, like, at least Frankie. And like bringing Frankie up to my chest. And I imagine you had the same experience like that, like that immediate skin to skin and like, how can you say? Yeah, I know this isn't a pre -verse podcast, but when you look at the biology of what the child and the mother needs, and they need you and you need them. If you look at hormonally and biologically how our bodies produce milk and the whole, we need each other to have that cascade of events happen. And when that's taken away, it doesn't happen. And people wonder why they can't breastfeed and they have like postnatal depletion and postnatal depression. And it's like, It's the easiest solution, but it's not because we haven't known anything different for the last hundred years. So how do you break from that and unlearn that when there's so much fear and judgment around it? Like you just, it's a lot. You've got to be a special type of person to really like, there's got to be something wrong with you to break through that. There's something wrong with me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's hard. But I just like, yeah. How can you say that? those babies. Like, I just think that yeah, in in birth, like, it's not just physical, it's not just the sense that they're there and they're there, like that baby's there. It's like, but the the actual connection is missing. And how can you say that that doesn't have long term impacts? Like generational impacts like I Yeah. Sorry listeners, if you don't agree. But that's a whole other rabbit hole. We can go down another day. But I think that's yeah, yeah. Pretty amazing, Brony. And yeah, good on you for going down that path because that's hard and confronting and healing those wounds. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it is. I know I talk to a lot of people now and they're like, you're lucky. And I'm like, no, I just, my body did what it was designed to do. I had a Yeah, more boring free birth actually. Like it's just, it just, yeah. But really I was like, my God, I'm amazing. Yeah, as you should be. so you find out you're pregnant. Did you have a wild pregnancy? Yeah. Yeah. While pregnancy, we had no testing. The only thing I did have was a blood test early on just to make sure that all my levels and everything were good. And I knew they would have been cause I really prepared myself, but they were that were perfect. so I was happy with that. And then, yeah, nothing we had no, the only thing I did was, my husband like adjusted me multiple times a week and yeah, that was it. I used homeopathy if I needed it really. And yeah, that was, yeah, we just looked after myself. I trained all throughout my pregnancy, like four or five times a week. it wasn't up until the last two weeks that I was like, I need to rest now. I'm very tired that I kind of stopped a little bit, but yeah, I was, is that like, Yeah, I've been a PT personal trainer for like 10 years. So I was never going to not go. I just had to change it all. So it was the pregnant woman in the gym still lifting weights and everything before. So yeah, yeah, it just looked after ourselves the whole time. And yeah, it was really nice. And I it's funny because we went through the whole like with our preconception, I was really calling in my baby like it was a conscious conception. Like we knew we wanted to have a child. And I know the moment we conceived. I knew the moment implantation happened. Like I was at the shop, I felt it, I had cramping. I was like out of my mind and didn't know what was going on. I couldn't remember what we were at the shop for. And I had to ask him like four times, like, what are we here for again? Like, what are we doing? And I was like, I'm pretty sure we've just conceived a baby and we did a test the week later and I was pregnant. I was like, I knew, I knew I was like everything just kind of. happened the way that it was supposed to happen. So I actually had a pretty smooth pregnancy. We were in Europe for the first month of it on our honeymoon. And I had like horrific nausea and food aversions. So the whole month away was awful that I was in Europe. I hated every minute of it. He had a great time. I was like, I want to go home. So that was hard. But yeah, when I came home, it was pretty, yeah, pretty good. Like I didn't really have any issues and any issues that we did have, we just like... dealt with it holistically, I guess. So nothing, nothing really of concern. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And did you work throughout your pregnancy as well? Yeah, I didn't try. I wasn't PTing. I was working from home in an office job. So that was good. I got to just kind of chill at home and do what I needed to. I couldn't wait to go on maternity leave though. Like I was like, I can't wait to not look at a computer. I was excited. Just pausing here to thank the May sponsor for the podcast. Let's talk birth and share a discount code with you all. Let's Talk Birth, they're dedicated to providing unwavering support to women as they prepare for childbirth and beyond. You can discover tailored doula support, created products, and expert guidance from endorsed midwives and certified lactation consultants, all in one convenient place. Join their community and experience a space of knowledge, compassion, and shared experiences as you navigate your pregnancy, birth, and postpartum journey. We hold the mother while she holds the baby. For an exclusive 15 % off this May, use the code LC15, that's E -L -S -I -E -15 at checkout. You can visit letstalkbirth .au to see all of their amazing products. I recently got the Bink glass water bottle and I love it, but they have amazing carriers and very, very cool brands in store. So make sure you check it out and thank you again so much, Let's Talk Birth for supporting the podcast. Okay, now we get on with the rest of the episode. Yeah, that's brilliant. Is there anything that so you did the free birth society course before you were pregnant? Is there anything that you did during your pregnancy education sort of wise? I mean, I spoke to many apart from my honestly, just spoke to honestly, the one thing I had concerned about was breastfeeding and I I thought to myself during my pregnancy that I may have issues breastfeeding. or like I might struggle. So I was really trying to get as much information around that as I could. And to be honest, there really wasn't a lot, like not a lot of women really talk about the first couple of weeks postpartum breastfeeding and how it feels. So that was a bit of a shock, but no, not really, to be honest, like we, we were, we knew we had it. We just knew everything. So it was actually a pretty chill pregnancy. I was outside a lot. And if I needed to connect with myself and my baby, I just did like, we didn't really do any. Honestly, it's, I just winged it. I just was like, yeah. I mean, that sounds like super chill to me. And I'm not normally a super chill person. I'm like, I need to know what's happening. Like, I need a six month plan. Tell me what's going on. But something about being pregnant, I was like, what will be will be. I know we're okay. Yeah, it was weird. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's amazing. Yeah. And like from Sean's perspective, he was just like, totally on board. Yeah. Yeah. No convincing whatsoever. He was like, Yep, that's what we're doing. Like he's more anti system than I am. So there was no convincing needed. He knew I had it like he just knew. Because I was so confident and I knew that I had it like not one part of me was scared to give birth. I was so excited. My whole pregnancy. I was so excited to do it because I thought me giving birth that is my initiation into becoming a woman. That is my initiation into motherhood and being like a true woman, you know, so for me, Yeah. Whatever was going to happen was supposed to happen for me to move into that next, you know, season of life. And I was excited to do it because I felt that I had shed the old me and I wanted to be birthed into the new me. So I was just so excited. Not one part of me was fearful at all. And he was like, yeah, you got this. Wait until you hear the birth story part about how he was. He's funny. and. Yeah, so when did we meet? It must have just been like, was it that we met? I was pregnant and I gave birth like three weeks later. So when I came to the one of the home birth meetups, I was like 38 or 39 weeks at that point. maybe 37, 38. And then I didn't come the next time because I had her and I came the time after that. Yeah. Okay. Okay. All right. Do you want to like... walk us through like, I guess the lead up and then your labor and both do it. So I have no. So you can see me looking up because I'm like, it's it all happened so far. So I think maybe for about two or three weeks, I had on and off maybe like prodromal labor. So I had a few nights where I was having cramping up really high and then a few nights where I was having cramping down low. The ones that were up high. I know that was like my funders knitting together like it was getting firm. I could feel it. I remember waking up, I was so nauseous. I was like, my God, I'm like, Sean, you need to get me, you need to get me a bowl. And he's like, what, what's going on? I'm like, I'm having cramps, I need a bowl. He's like, for the placenta, you're gonna need more than a bowl if you're giving birth now. And I'm like, no. A bowl for the placenta, that's brilliant. He was funny, but he was like, no, you're fine. And the day of, and I was feeling quite, I don't know, it just like. in a bit of a daze, I guess, especially the week leading up to it. Now that I look back, I was a bit kind of like all over the place. We had just moved things. We were just trying to settle in. And I remember I had a dream two nights before and my mum came to me in a dream and she never has before. And she looked at me like she was really proud of herself. Like she had done a lot of like work on herself in the afterlife kind of situation. And I was like, what are you smiling at? And then she was like, you're going to have your birth at home tomorrow. And I was like, okay. And I went into labor, like at 11 o'clock. Yeah. I don't want to say labor cause I'm like my birth process will say birth process. I feel like labor associates it with like horrific work. And I'm like, yeah. Like you're in the mines, like digging with a shovel all day. Yeah. About 11 o 'clock I started to have pains and cramping and they were maybe like half an hour apart and that was super mild. Like I just thought it was just. part of my normal day, because I had had some cramping, so I wasn't really too concerned. And at this point, I was 40 weeks and three days. Yeah, I think. 40 and three. And Sean got home at maybe like 1230. I was like, I'm just letting you know, I've had like some wild cramping about every half an hour to 40 minutes for the last two hour and a half. And he was like, okay, we'll keep an eye on it. So we were kind of just like fluffing about a little bit and he wasn't going back to work until later. So he was making me lunch, but the cramping was getting like shorter and shorter in time. It was, you know, I think he wrote it down. It was like 30 minutes and then 20 minutes and 15 and it got down to seven. But I was in denial. I was like, go back to work. If this is it and I am having the baby, I'm gonna be in this process like 20 minutes, 20 hours or something. I was convinced I was gonna have a very long like birth process. And as they got closer and closer, I couldn't eat my food between like, I had to stop put my food down. I was sitting on the ball and then I'd continue my food. And he was like, he called work. He's like, I'm not going back in. Can you call my patients and let them know I'm coming? But I didn't know. I was like, no, we're fine. So my sister rang me. She was like, hey, going. And I'm like, yeah, I'm still having the cramping, but you don't need to come. It's okay. Sean literally rang her 10 minutes later and was like, you need to pack a bag and you need to come. My best friend also came over. She had sent me a message earlier, we were going to catch up for a coffee around the corner. And I said, I've been cramping. Maybe you could just come here. She's like, Yeah, I'll come over there. Little did anyone know it was gonna happen. But I was still pretty chill. But it got to the point where I couldn't really talk between them. But I was during them. Yeah, I was very vocal during them. And I was feeling quite nauseous. I literally went to the toilet like six or seven times like, and I had a contraction on the toilet. my God. It was like while I was pooing, it was the most painful thing. I reckon that was more painful than the birth itself. I was not having a bar of that. yeah. And then we got to put the tens machine on my back. So I was pretty much on my knees leaning over the back end of the couch, basically the whole time. At this point, everything had escalated within a two hour period. So it was about 4pm. so everything was happening super quick. I wanted to have a shower because I wanted to get in the birth pool and I was like, I can't get in the birth pool. I've shat like seven times, like, let me go have a shower first and then I'll get in the pool. And so Sean walks me into the shower and I had the worst contraction that I had had so far where I was bearing down. Like as soon as the water touched my back and I was standing up, I was bearing down. Like my body was just pushing and I had no control over it. I was like, we need to get into the pool. Yeah, we need to speed this up. And I had this plan, right? I was like, my fairy lights were set up. I had all my affirmations hanging up like the whole room was perfect. I had the essential oils I was going to use. I had a playlist that was going to happen. Like, I had everything ready. And I just all of that went out the window. I was like, I don't care. I don't care about the music. I don't care about the oils. I had two big tubs set up for like two weeks or three weeks that had you know, like waterproof sheets, painter's sheets on there, maybe like 20 white towels and basically everything that I think I would need for the process. So my sister and my friend could just grab anything I needed while Sean was supporting me. And I had birth combs basically the whole time. So I held those the whole time. And that was basically, that was it. I was on. So I got in the pool and let me check my notes. I got in the pool about like four ish o'clock, I think it was. And then at four, I don't know where the notes are. Four something. That's all right. I'm like, what? It was so, it was so fast. I literally gave birth two hours later. So I think it was maybe about 4 .40 my mucus plug released. Yeah. And I saw that in the pool. And so had you made it, so you made it to the pool? I was in the pool. my mucus bug released, maybe 40 minutes later, so it was about 5 .30, I felt my waters pop in me while I was still in the pool. And again, I was still on all fours, like on my hands and knees leaning over the birth pool. And then 45 minutes later, there she was. And I was like, what do you mean? So I felt her crowning. It took maybe three surges to get her head fully out. She kind of kept going back up and coming back down. On the second surge, I could feel like a stinging sensation more like to the front of my vagina. And I was like, that's not the ring of fire. Like something's definitely hurting me there, but that was fine. I just put pressure on it. And I remember looking back and being like, she just keeps going back up. And he's like, that's okay. Just breathe. Just take your time. He was so good during the whole thing. Like he just sat behind me in the birth pool. He had his hands on my hips. But at that point he was literally just resting his hands there. Like he wasn't putting pressure. He was allowing my hips to open. He was like, I'm not going to push them back together if they want to open. So I'll just, but to me, I thought he was still putting pressure on cause I could feel his hands there. And between them, he was rubbing my back. And then finally her head emerged and I like roared her out, like roared every, every contraction because I was bearing down. It was almost like a dry reach noise. I couldn't help it. My body was just doing it. And I was like, I'm just going with it. So her head came out and he was looking down at her and I felt something else, like her arm shot out as well. And I felt her arm pop out and I was like, my God. Shawn's like, her little hand's out. And I was like, yeah, I felt it. I could feel it come out. And then she was just kind of there with her head hanging out, waving at him and looking at him while I was just waiting for the next surge to get her out. The next surge came around and I don't know, the fetal ejection reflex kicked in and out she came. So like straight into his hands and he kind of pushed her up under his, my leg to get back to me. And I was in shock. He helped me roll over so I could hold her and I literally, I'll have to send you the video. I was literally just lying, like sitting in the pool holding this little baby. And I was just, you know, when you're crying and you're like shaking, cause you're crying so much, like that's what I was doing. I couldn't get words out. I was like, my God, I did it. Like I did it. I could not believe it. I was like, I can't believe I did that. She was perfect. She wasn't blue or purple. She was pink straight away. She cried within seconds of her being out and she latched onto me like within minutes of her being out of the pool. Like she was just absolutely perfect. Nothing, full head of hair. Nothing was, I remember feeling. Cause I was like, I wonder how far like I was so confused when I was in labor because I said the word. when I was in my birth process, because I could still feel her up high, but I could feel her head in my pelvis. And I was like, I don't know what's going on. So I felt, and I could just feel this squishy, hairy thing. And I was like, I think that's her head. As she got closer and closer, I was like, Sean, feel. And he was like, yeah, that's her. I was like, yeah, she's got a hairy little head. So she comes out, full head of hair. Sean's like, throw on your babies here. And I was like, and I'm holding her and I'm trying to check to see like is she a boy or a girl? I thought she was a boy the whole pregnancy. I was convinced that she was a boy. And then she comes out and I'm like, my god, it's a girl. I was like, my heart, my heart, I can't deal with it. So, yeah, it was crazy. I just couldn't, I had a little bit of a short cord as well. Like my placenta cord was a bit short. So I felt like I couldn't bring her up as much as I wanted to because it was a little bit short. It was wrapped around her. leg and her body, I think a little bit as well, but I wasn't concerned. Like I just unwrapped her and that was it. Yeah. Yeah. It was great. Yeah. Whoa. And so you had your friend, like one of your best friends and your sister. Yeah. I had my best friend and my sister there. Yeah. And they filmed it and they were like, yeah, they were good. Cause I had to write them. Like I wrote them a, like a letter beforehand of notes, like. This is the music I want. This is where this is going to be. This is where this is going to be. Please don't, you know, pull weird faces. Don't give me a worried look. Like I really prepared them to be like, if you can't handle what is happening, that's totally fine. But I need you to exit the room. I can't feel your energy. I can't feel the shift. I can't see your face. If you're worried, I don't want anybody to get in my head. So if it's too much for you, you can just walk out and I'm totally fine with that. but they were good. They were just there and passing me water and putting a washcloth on my back if I needed it and moving my hair out of my face and just filming and taking pictures. They were just great. Had they ever seen Birth Before? Do you know? I sent them heaps of like free Birth Before videos and I was like, my God, look at these people. Look at their support crew. How great were they? Like I sent them a heap of videos, but not that would have been the first that they'd ever seen. Wow. But that's like, Yeah, I mean, like the the energy like the female energy. Yeah, I'm witnessing that like, wow, I think it's rawest form and seeing a woman being so primal and like, just how amazing and I imagine it would have been very scary for them because they didn't know what to expect. And they don't know any different to, you know, most people. I'm the abnormal one. So I understand it would have been a lot for them to also. process that and deal with that and be okay with being there for me. So like, I know that was a big ask to them and I wasn't offended if they were going to say no. But no, they were fantastic. I'm so glad they were there and they got to witness that. And even if they don't go down this path, they will go down a similar path because they've seen how awesome it can be. Yeah. Super empowering. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the fact that they know about it is like the first step because most people don't even know. I didn't. that it exists, that it's legal, that you can just do it. You don't have to get any special permission, any consent form. You can just have a baby. Do you have to be somewhere for that? No, you just do it. Even now I laugh about it because she's two months old, nearly three months old, and no one knows that she exists. No sister, nobody. She's just here living her best life, doing really well. We're actually going through the process of registering her and it is really difficult, you know, for anyone who wants to rebirth for warning, it is difficult that they do not like you doing it. So you have to have a plan in place before. But it is legal. It is legal. It's not illegal. It's legal and it's possible. They just make it difficult for you. They just make it hard. 100%. Yeah. And when was the placenta born? Yeah, so within five minutes, I reckon of her being born, it was, you know, I had cramps basically straight away and pushed it out. The only thing is the part of the membrane was actually still stuck up for quite a while. I have old scar tissue and I knew it was going to be an issue and I wholeheartedly believe that that membrane was stuck up onto that old scar tissue. And it was quite painful. Like I couldn't, I couldn't pull it out. I was trying to like cough and pull and just relax. She latched on fairly like quickly. So I thought maybe that would help. And I thought I'll just chill in the pool for a little bit. I'll put some towels on her. I'll keep her warm. I'll keep her on me. Maybe about an extra hour had passed and I still couldn't get it out. Like it was hurting to pull on it, but the whole placenta was out. Like I had it in my hands, but there was just some membrane stuff. So I thought. The cord's completely white. Let's cut the cord. You take her, I'll stand up with my placenta and maybe gravity will help a little bit. It was a bad idea. The second that I stood up with it, it just ripped off. It just was not ready. And I didn't bleed at all into the birth pool. Even when she was out, the water was clear. But the second that that ripped off, I lost a lot of blood, like a lot of blood. I was white and shaky and... wasn't doing too well, I made my way over to the couch and lied down and had her back on me. And they were feeding me fruit and like electrolytes. And I was like, I'm very coherent. Everything's fine. I'm not having like, PPH or anything. But if I was in the hospital, they probably would have said, I am hemorrhaging. But I felt good within myself and I knew what to look for again. And I just lied down and stayed horizontal and kept my legs crossed. And You know, my sister was great. She was helping changing the pads that I had onto me and like, I was like, whatever, I've got this baby. You guys can do the rest for me. So tend to me. Yeah. We had my own person to encapsulate it as well. So we had, Emily, she's the authentic birthkeeper on Instagram. Yeah, she's beautiful. She came over. It was maybe nine o 'clock or something at night and she came over and. Got the placenta and Sean was so excited about the placenta. Like he put it in a container and went and showed his family in the kitchen. Like, this is the placenta and this is the membrane and this is where she lived. And these are the cot. Like he was, yeah, it was a big placenta too. So she came over and she, what were you going to say? I was going to say, so your family, so it's Sean's family, right? Yeah. We're at the in -laws. Yeah. And so, yeah. So like, Did you ever see or hear them at all during the birth process? No, we made it really clear, like just say away, let us deal with it and everything is fine. And they completely just respected that? Yeah, like we had to have a few conversations with them to put their mind at ease. A lot of conversations? Yeah, because obviously it's scary for them. But no, they just they left. But because it was so quick, everything happened so fast. Like they went for a walk with the dog and they went down to a cafe and had a drink and came back and they heard me. laughing and a baby crying and I was like, no, I was crying. I was crying laughing. But yeah, like everything was fine. So no, they were okay. They were not interested really in looking at the placenta. But he was like very excited. that's such a shame. I know. I mean, like they are, but you know, not as much as we were. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But we had it encapsulated and she cut off a couple of raw pieces for us as well. So I could have that into a smoothie. So Sean was making me a... placenta smoothie the next day, which was great. Yeah. What kind of stuff do you know what Sean added to the smoothie? Yeah, I can ask him. He added banana, some coconut water, probably some strawberries and blueberries and ice and yeah, probably some beef liver and my placenta. Yeah, just like that. And yeah, once it's once it's all like munched up like. Yeah, you can't even you can't even taste it literally just tasted like a banana and strawberry smoothie. And he had some he's like, yeah, just tastes like a banana smoothie. Yeah, it was gross. It tastes like banana. It was gross. It tastes like banana. He doesn't like banana. Yeah. that's brilliant. Yeah. Wow. And I had some tearing. So like, when Emily came, she actually checked me, which I was grateful for. And I had a graze from where her hand came out as well. course. Yeah, I think I might have had a few grazers because it felt like I did in certain spots, but I didn't really look. And for the week and a half, maybe two weeks post birth, we use like medical grade Manuka honey, and then a strip of like seaweed like nori on it because it acts like a bandaid. Yeah, so that's how I attended to my my wound and it healed up pretty quickly. So yeah, I wasn't really too stressed about that. But I was really shocked postpartum. Like, I thought, I'm going to be fine because everything is good, but I think I really truly did lose a lot of blood because for the next three days, any time I got up to go to the toilet, I was shaking. I was shaking. So I was like, I need a steak. I was having steaks for breakfast. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. When did you sort of start to feel yourself again? I don't know. It's really hard to say because I was quite shocked about postpartum. So for me, my tailbone, like came out. So for people who don't know, it's very common, very normal for your tailbone to actually shift outwards as the head is coming down or even before you're birthing the head. that's your pelvis shifting and, but mine was quite noticeable. Like you could see it, you could feel it. So for me, my postpartum was hard because I couldn't sit up, I couldn't sit on it because it was poking out. Thank God I had Sean adjusting me, but it was like, it was quite hard. So I had to sidely feed her. But when your milk is coming in, sidelying feeding is, it's like the hardest way to feed. And I couldn't figure out how to do it. So I would say it was a few weeks before I was feeling better. And then I fell. out the back with her in my arms, I fell. my god. Yeah, like worst fear unlocked. I just like held her so close to my body so she wouldn't have had any idea that I fell, but I landed so hard on my ribs that I sprained my ribs. So they're still sprained. They're still painful. So my healing would have been fine if that part didn't happen. But she's feeding on me and she's blocking her nose. You okay? So yeah, the postpartum, to be honest, I wish that more women really spoke about postpartum and how it can be in terms of healing because, you know, I was so determined that I was not going to get up out of bed, this bounce back culture can like, get stuffed, like I am gonna rest, I'm gonna recover. But the guilt that you feel, as a woman not getting up and doing things forces you to get up and do things and it just pushes your recovery back and I wish that I had honoured myself more and just actually taken the time to not do anything but again the fall messed me up but I don't know I think I'm like two and a half months in now with her and I feel like things are starting to feel more normal and easier. I found breastfeeding quite hard in the beginning because I really didn't know what to expect. And now I think it's just the most beautiful thing in the world. So, you know, for those of you who are struggling with it, just persist and, you know, get the right help. I feel like there's so much wrong information out there on it. And like, even, you know, when they're first born, it's so normal for them to lose like up to 10 % or something of their body weight in the first week. And, you know, I wasn't stressed about that. when that happened with her because I knew that that was gonna happen and I don't know, we just really prepared ourselves for all the things that would happen but I didn't prepare myself for what would happen to my body. Yeah, that's so true. Yeah, you don't, you just think that everything's gonna be fine and that like my boobs were so sore they were on fire. I was living with cabbage leaves on them, I had pain like in my armpits and down my arms and I was like, my god, they're so engorged and like my milk came in literally. the next day, like, yeah. And I'm like her tiny little marble stomach, she's got a pea stomach and my boobs are like bigger than her head. How is she going to take this and milk? So, yeah, yeah. I remember, I remember, yeah, like I had organized maybe in the week before Frankie was born, I had thought, I want to do some like self care. So I organized a Dula to come. like after Frankie was born for like a postpartum massage and to do belly binding. And she said, I'll just message me like when you've had your baby, blah, blah, blah. So I messaged her anywhere she comes and she's doing the massage and yeah, my milk had come in and I did not, I had not thought that, holy crap, my boobs, it was just like, it was just not comfortable. It was, yeah, it was, painful because they're just like explode. Well, yeah, I mean, they're so engaged. Mine were exploding. And I just thought like, yeah, you don't you don't think about that kind of stuff. You got no idea how it's going to be. Mine was hot. They were hot. They were cooking the cabbage leaves. I was going through cabbages. I messaged my friend. I was like, you need to pick me up a cabbage. And she came with a cabbage. And she's like, I don't like, do you need a whole one? I got a whole one. Is that what you need? I'm looking for my boobs. I was using it like a lot of homeopathy and, and like, stupid me. Like, I don't know. I was Googling like, can you have a bath postpartum? And everyone was like, no, you can't, you shouldn't do that. And then I was like, what do you mean you can't do that? Once I realized I could do it, I was having like some salt baths on the regular because that was the only thing that helped like the breast pain and like the swelling in my body and. Yes. Have a bath. Do they say that you can't have baths? That's so dumb. Yeah, they're like for risk of infection. And I was like, biggest lie I've ever heard. Yeah. my gosh. You better not open the bath. You might drown. I know, right? But honestly, like, anybody about to have a baby or the first or the second, like, prepare yourself postpartum. Like, don't just cook, you know, meals for a few dinners here or there. Like, if you have the means. Cook yourself like three weeks worth of lunches and dinners. Like have it ready, have it there, have an easy way to defrost it, have the support because bless my husband was literally like my waiter. Breakfast, lunch and dinner, drinks, teas. Like, because I could not sit up to feed her and I couldn't quite even figure out how to feed. there were moments where he was sitting behind me so I could rest on him to try to sit up to feed her because I couldn't lean. Like he was just my absolute savior and not everybody has that kind of support. So set yourself up in case you don't have that support because it's wild, especially if you're trying to heal and your emotions are all over the place. If you don't have the help there, it's so much harder than it needs to be. Like next time I'll cook way more food. Way more food. that's so good. What an amazing, amazing story. I know, I can't believe I did it. I can't believe it. Yeah. I think you've already like touched on it, but you know, like how like pre pre-pregnancy or pre birth Bronnie and, you know, mother Bronnie like how. What's the difference? Like, how do you feel the difference is? I don't know. I think something changed during the pregnancy where there was a bit of like a family thing and I had to really be firm. And normally I'm just a yes person and I just kind of keep things down if it means that people are going to be happy and something happens during the pregnancy. And I was like, well, screw you then. Like, that's not happening or you don't get to see me then. And I was so firm on that. And I've stayed firm on that and having her has probably embedded that further in me, maybe a little bit too much, but I am like, don't come between my family. Like if I don't like you or if I feel that you're not a nice person or whatever it is, I have no issues like cutting the person out. Even during the pregnancy, I lost some friends, which was really hard because I were long, long, long -term friends. But during the pregnancy, I was like, well, well. If you don't like the way I'm going and what I'm doing, then that's fine. I don't, I don't want you around, but prior to that, I would have been an emotional mess and tried anything to get the people to like me again. That's what I'm like. I'm a people pleaser. I want people to like me. I care about people's opinions of me. And now I just don't care. Like all that matters is what she thinks of me. And she's going to think I'm like a bad-ass person for doing this. So like, I don't, I don't care. So that's probably what it is. I just, I'm probably more fearless and way less. Like I don't care about people's opinions as much, but I do feel like if someone crossed me, I would really have to teach them a lesson. Yeah. I can't let that go. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. That's incredible. Thank you so, so much for sharing. Such an amazing, quick, beautiful. So quick. Sometimes. All struck like. Yeah, just so powerful story, Bronnie. Like the most intense thing anybody can go through, like. Just the most incredible thing, like, I don't know, people are like, birth can be pain free and I'm like, you're lying. Yeah, yeah, I'm not. I like amazing if that's how you describe it. But for me personally, birth is not pain free. Having said that, I would birth at home, like birth at home. Yeah, you forget. for fair than ever. You do forget, you do forget. And I've listened to probably over 50 hours of birth stories at this point. So I've definitely forgotten. Yeah, they do. For the first two weeks, I was like, I can't do that again. I can't do that again. And it was purely because I felt nauseous during the whole process. But then postpartum, I was like, this is, I want to say the F word, but this is messed up. Like this is so, I'm like, how can anybody do this? I'm not doing this again. And now I'm like, I am probably doing this again. Like, yeah. I just like live for like the thrill. Like I just want the moment. Like I know you have to go through the birth process and you know, all of that. But I just want that moment where you just pull them up and then it's, and it's the first time ever that this. this baby has ever been held in this world. And that's that's all you and you know, they covered in verdicts and like, I know, it's just, we left all over on her. I was like, rub it into a skin, rub it in. I'm like, we're not bathing her. It's honestly a crazy experience. And even now watching her learn and develop and figuring out her hands and you know, just being able to see the world. again through her eyes is really humbling, I think, for people. If you're not present during your child's development, you miss out on these beautiful experiences. If you're just on your phone or you're watching TV or someone else looks after them, you miss out on reliving and re-experiencing everything for the first time. I think it's really important that people slow down. Postpartum teaches you to slow down, okay? Yeah, yeah, absolutely, absolutely. And yeah, well, I mean, I've... like learned having like a second baby is that like, yeah, you have to learn that some things you're just not going to be able to do right now. Like, it's just not okay with it. Yeah, you have to be okay with it. And like, re evaluating your expectations of like, you know, by with Murphy, I was kind of like, just like go wherever and do whatever. But I now I'm like, like if I go there and this is going to happen, it's going to be very exhausting. We're all going to end up crying. And it's just like, choose, choose your battles. But, you learn, you learn to go with the flow as best you can. I know there's one woman in our group. and she, she came to, one of the meetups and she had only given birth like two or three weeks prior. And I was like, my God, like, what are you doing up and about? And then she traveled. Travel. to America. And I was like, my God, I'm like, I didn't even want to go to the shop five minutes around the corner because like, what if she cries? Or what if she like shits herself? Yeah. And she was like, yeah, I was on a plane by herself. With a two month I was like, girl, you're crazy. Like good on her. Like I just, my brain just didn't work that way. I couldn't, the stress of me going, what if she cries in the shop or what if she like shits herself and I don't have enough wipes? Like. I've missed her nap time, my god. You've really got to learn to go with the flow, don't you? Just let it go. Yeah. Did you have anything else that we haven't talked about or that you wanted to say before we finish up? No, I don't think so. Just thank you so much for having me on. I know this is a bit of a different story probably to some of the other people, but it's nice to hear different ways, I guess, and that for anyone who's maybe thinking of doing it or scared, totally don't be scared that we got this. our ancestors are living proof that we have survived birth for hundreds of thousands of years. Like we got this. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 100%. 100 % Ronnie. And yeah, stay tuned listeners, because I'm definitely going to be interviewing Sean. I just have to organise it. I know. But yeah, what a cool experience for both of you. Yeah, it was awesome. Thank you.