Episode 34 is from Mel, who whilst recording her homebirth story on the podcast in episode 11, was planning a frebirth during her wild pregnancy with Lakai. So today, we hear the beautiful and inspiring story of how Mel birthed Lakai at home, trusting her body and intuition completely, having done a lot of preperation for this radical responsiblity.
Links to resources:
Episode 34 is from Mel, who whilst recording her homebirth story on the podcast in episode 11, was planning a frebirth during her wild pregnancy with Lakai. So today, we hear the beautiful and inspiring story of how Mel birthed Lakai at home, trusting her body and intuition completely, having done a lot of preperation for this radical responsiblity.
Links to resources:
You're listening to Birthing at Home, a podcast. I'm Elsie, your host. I recorded this episode on unceded Wurundjeri land in Nam, Melbourne, Australia, where Aboriginal peoples had been birthing at home on country for thousands of years prior to the British invasion. They are the original storytellers. If you want to learn more about me, the podcast or how I can support you in achieving your home birth, be sure to check out my Instagram at birthingathome.com. Episode 34 is the free birth story of Lakai, a story from Mel who shared her first story with us on episode 11. Mel is a Womorei woman from Newcastle and if you want to hear her first home birth story, check out episode 11. Today we will only hear the recent unassisted birth story of Lakai, how Mel prepared, enjoyed her wild pregnancy where she lent into listening to her intuition and then her experience of a normal boring birth. Mel also shares about her hospital transfer for a third degree tear. It's a great episode for anyone planning to birth at home. Enjoy. Welcome Mel to Birthing at Home, a podcast again. Hi, Elsie. Thank you for having me. Again. I know. I'm so, so excited to talk to you today. For the listeners who haven't listened yet, Mel was in episode 11. And she shared the birth story of her first baby Alaska. But for the listeners that, you know, haven't heard that story and don't know your background and whatnot, Mel, do you want to give like a little overview about who you are, who's in your family? Sure. So I'm Mel. I'm a mama of two little ones now. I've got a two and a half year old Alaska who I home birthed back in 2021. And then I've just given birth five weeks ago to a little boy named Makai, who was also born at home. Yeah. Oh, and I have a husband, sorry. I live with my husband, Jesse as well. Yeah. Amazing. So I, we would just discuss this lesson. So maybe Mel, do you want to give like a little overview of, I guess. Maybe, no, if you want to hear about Alaska's birth, you need to go listen to episode 11. But maybe do you want to sort of reflect Mel on, you know, how you felt after Alaska's birth and, cause with Alaska you had midwives, right? Yeah. So I had a private midwife for Alaska. Yeah. Who I was very fortunate was one of the rare ones. that truly supported women, there was really no conditions to my care. So I was allowed to go past my due date and didn't have to do standardized testing and things like that. So I thought I had an amazing birth in Alaska. Um, until I had this birth and I can really compare the two now. Um, so yeah, I've had, I've been fortunate to have two really beautiful, very different births. Yeah. Yeah. And, um, were there like particular reasons that you're comfortable to share why you decided to just, you know, um, birth without. you know, a health care provider like a midwife this time around? Yeah, so my first midwife had been deregistered when he was no longer practicing as a home birth midwife. So that option was sort of gone. And when I felt pregnant and I looked at the options in my area, there was no one that I truly aligned with, that I, you know, felt like I'd like to invest money in. Um, and once I was pregnant, I just had this innate calling to free birth. Like I didn't feel like I needed to go, um, I needed to have a midwife or I didn't feel the need to go and get tests or scans straight away. So it was a completely different experience. Um, so I just lent into that, I think. And, um, I sort of like spoke it over with my husband and said, look, this is what I'm thinking. I think I might just want to have a birthkeeper or a doula. Um, and then maybe like in my early, my first trimester, we just said, okay, let's look for a doula or a birthkeeper or someone to support us in that space. Um, so yeah, it just really felt like it just felt like the right path for me at the time. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Um, what was the process to, you know, choosing a doula or a birthkeeper that would support like a free birth? Because I know it's like, very controversial issue about free birth and you know who supports it, who doesn't, blah blah blah. But you know, like what was that process like for you? Yeah, so I'm actually in Newcastle, which is a really good community of home birthers and free birthers. But the surprising thing was that all of the doers that I knew supported free births were all having babies or they were like postpartum themselves. Yeah. So I actually found it quite hard. I was really only looking for a birth worker that had worked in the free birth space. I didn't want, you know, there's some amazing dollars that do a mix of hospital and home birth, but I didn't want their, I don't know, I suppose maybe their fears or things that they've experienced in hospital births to come into my space. I ended up looking on the central coast, which I'm pretty much halfway between Newcastle and the central coast anyway, and I found a couple and I met with two and I just didn't feel a hundred percent like a full body yes. And then I spoke to the woman that actually ended up choosing on the phone. And when I went to meet with her, I literally seen her walking across the car park and I was like, she's it. That's my person. And it was just, I don't know if anyone else has had that experience, but it was like my whole body was like, this is my, yeah, this is my doula. So yeah, I was very fortunate to find Jenna, who is my birthkeeper. And she supported me a lot, really mainly in pre birth. Like we did a lot of sessions around like rite of passage work and a lot of mental prep around shedding the maiden me and meeting the intensity of birth and coming out the other side as a new mom. I think that really played a role in my mindset going into this birth. So that was a lot of the work we did. She also did a mother's blessing for me, which was like... so weird for me because I've always been like when she first mentioned it, I was like, oh, like people coming together to celebrate me like yuck. Yeah. And she really like was like, it's like a really important journey. And I think, I think you should consider it. And I finally did. And it was amazing. Yeah. It was so beautiful. I remember seeing a picture, like, I don't know where one, one of your Instagrams and I I'm so jealous. Such a special experience. What kind of stuff like did you do at the Mother Blessing? Yeah, so we... What did we do? So I got like a foot soak. I had pretty much anyone that was really important to me. I got like my feet rubbed. I got my head massage. All the women in the circle, they all had like bunting flags and they all drew on them to go up in my birth space. They all brought like a crystal as well to go onto like a birthing necklace for me. Yeah, there was a lot. And then the actual, the really beautiful thing was they all went around and sort of said like, I don't know what the question was, but like they gave me, I think it was just wise words for going into my next journey. And it was women that were in the space and they'll being really vulnerable. And they'll saying like, oh, like you really inspire me. And you know, that day when I watched you with your daughter, that sparked something with me in my own parenting journey. And I was like getting so emotional. Just you never have the time and the space to sit down and hear that from people. Yeah. Um, and there was so many tears, just like people being so vulnerable. It was just, yeah, it was really beautiful. Yeah. Um, we also all like connected via a, um, thread thread and everyone tied it off and then I wore it in my birth. And then once I'd given birth, everyone cut theirs. So we're all like connected and I had the strength of them during my birth. So yeah, if anyone's considering it, I highly recommend. It's a really beautiful thing to be blessed with before you go into labor land. Yeah, that's so special. And I think, yeah, something about the energy. When I had Murphy, I also had like a mother blessing. But I don't know if any of the people that were there would listen to this. But. They, yeah, I just felt like I was the same as you. I was like, oh my gosh, actually like all of this attention. Um, but they also, yeah, I guess birth often, you know, in our sort of broader Australian culture, like lacks that spiritual. Nurse, you know, and like, I think that's so, so special that like you cut the cord and they cut like the red thread and yeah. Wow. Did your doula, do you call her a doula or a birthkeeper? I call her a birthkeeper. That's sort of what, yeah, she goes by now. Yeah. Yeah. Did you, like, obviously you said you worked on like rider passage stuff and whatnot. Was there anything that you really had to work on to sort of overcome, especially, you know, off the back of like giving birth to Alaska and, you know, having experienced birth before? The one thing that I suppose I had to, the only fear that I had going into my birth was that I would have another like three or four day labor. Which I always said like I've done it before. I've done it before, I know I can definitely do it again but that was like my fear like oh what if that happens and you know I call them over and then it eases off. The other thing was we did a really cool activity with me and my husband and she asked him what my maiden traits are that I think I may need to shed moving forward. It was so interesting to hear him come up with some and I came up with some. One was that he was like, you're like a people pleaser and you always bend over backwards for people. especially in my end of pregnancy, I was doing things for people for free or like going out of my way. And I probably should have been like more in my own bubble and like, you know, taking care of myself more. And that was something I worked on like saying no, if I didn't have like a full body. Yes. Yeah. That literally changed so many things for me. And I realized how much I actually did it. Yeah. So yeah, I started and I just remember her saying like, now is your time to be selfish. If you're going to be selfish anytime, it's like when you're pregnant or when you're postpartum, that's your time. So yeah, I embraced being selfish for the first time in my life, which was beautiful. And the other one, the one that I came up with was like, judgment. I think as much as we want to say we don't judge, I feel like, And like, innately, we all have this like side of us where we can look at people and judge from the outside. So that was something I worked on as well. And just accepting that like other people's journey is not mine. Yeah. But yeah, they were sort of the main things that we worked on, which really helped me. Yeah. Yeah. And like, did you have a completely wild pregnancy as well? Yeah. So I didn't have bloods or like any medical scans, like any diagnostic scans or growth scans. Yeah. I didn't see a GP at all actually. Yeah. So that sounds so freeing. I feel like my anxiety just went down. Yeah. And it just felt like it's not that I was against that. Like if I ever felt. Um, I think when I spoke to you, I was like last time I was saying, yeah, I'll get bloods at 30 weeks. And I just never felt like I needed it. Like I'd never had that calling, um, to go do that. Like if I felt unwell or I felt like I needed it, I definitely would have, or if I felt like I needed a scan, I would have, but I just never, never did. So, um, I just followed that. I think. Yeah. Wow. Um, and what was it like then to, you know, feel the first movement or, you know, sit in that uncertainty of like, how many weeks am I or, you know, how was that for you? Yeah, I'm not saying that like, you know, everyone at Freeburst needs to go through this stage, but it is such an incredible feeling leaning into that complete unknown. And it's like really, that's how you ignite the trust in your body. Just, you know, from getting a pregnancy test to when you feel a movement, I think I felt movements really early, like maybe 12 weeks or something. Until you feel that proper movements, it's like you're sitting in the unknown, but you just lean into it, right? And it was, I just can't explain it. It was just such an incredible feeling. And then... You know, I'd be like feeling my belly and going, Oh, I think they're really big or like then towards the end, like you become a pro at knowing where your baby is. Yeah. Um, you know, knowing if you did act like certain activities that day, they, you know, move into this position or you really become the expert of your own body. Um, it's a, yeah, incredible journey. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm just like, That's so cool. I, um, uh, I feel what her Instagram handle is, but I remember speaking with, uh, her name's Jesse. Um, but, and when she told me about, you know, not taking a pregnancy test and like feeling the first movements, I was like, wow, that is like so cool. Cause really that is like the first intervention. That's the first time that you have to use something or that you don't have to, but you use something to, like check yourself and that, you know, I mean that act in itself might not be, you know, the reason why you don't trust your body, but it certainly filters into it, you know, um, and I just think that's like so, so amazing. Um, and was there any point during your pregnancy where you were, I guess, doubting your body or yourself or you were tempted by a scan or a test or? No Yeah, not at all. I I did have like really early on I had conversations with my husband around because I had birth before at 43 weeks. Yeah And I, you know, was sort of thinking, is that my normal? Like I had a 3 .6 kilo baby, so she wasn't big. And I've had friends that have free birth at 35 or 36 weeks. So I had said to my husband, like, oh, if it like 35 or 36 weeks, I went into labor, maybe I would go and see if I could get a scan and just check that baby is like at an appropriate size. Or like I had had those thoughts like, oh, would I? Would I go to hospital or what if I went to hospital and had a completely normal size baby and then I've just like sabotage my own birth. But yeah, I had sort of those thoughts really early on, but as I progressed through, I just, I knew that I wouldn't. Um, I think, yeah, I just gained that, that, you know, like connection with my baby and I knew that they'd come at the right time. Yeah. Yeah. Was there anything in particular that helped with that trust in yourself? in birth to, you know, make it even stronger. Like obviously you, you lack me. Well, I hear birth stories and you read birth stories all the time with your Instagram, but you know, was there anything in particular, did you like redo like any particular education or stuff like that? Yeah, I actually did sort of opposite. So I was. I stripped down everything I knew about birth. I was like, every story I've heard, every education, because I had done previously done hypnobirthing and obviously a lot of self -education. And I just stripped down everything I knew and I just strictly looked at physiology. I didn't want to have any outside conditioning. I just wanted to look at. the basics of birth really. So I've really gravitated towards a lot of like Dr. Rachel Reed stuff. Obviously her book, Childbirth as a Writer Passage was great. A lot of like online articles by her and Dr. Sarah Wickham, which just look at the physiology of birth and the actual evidence, right? I love that about Dr. Sarah Wickham actually is that like, Her background is maths and statistics and then she's also this like incredibly educated midwife and you know, PhD researcher. So her stuff is actually like highly regarded. Yeah. And I just loved, I've become a huge birth nerd at just like diving into all of that, that stuff that people probably think is really boring. I also started to think towards the end of my pregnancy, I was like, oh, I haven't looked over like my hypnobirthing breathing or anything. And I sat with that for a little while and I was like, I don't feel the need to. I just had this thing internally where I was like, am I gonna get into birth and forget how to breathe and freak out that I haven't trained to breathe? Like that was one side of my brain. And then the other side was like, no, like you don't need to do that. And I didn't. And I did find with my first birth, I was focusing too much on how many breaths I had to take for this hypnobirthing method. But I almost got into this like fixation with it and would freak out if I wasn't breathing correctly. Where I did not even think about it this time and my body just did it. My body just breathed exactly in different stages of my labor. It just kicked in how I needed to breathe. innately without even thinking about it or knowing I was doing it. Yeah, a lot of self -education but primarily just on the physiology. Yeah, I tried not to look anything outside of that and although I was reading a lot of birth stories, in my first pregnancy I listened to every birth story I could. This time I was, I didn't feel called to that either. I was sort of just like not wanting other people's experiences to, you know, make me envision some type of birth that wasn't mine. So, um, yeah, I just, yeah, that's sort of what I did this time around. Yeah. And, um, telling like your loved ones or, you know, even friends perhaps like that you were going to birth without, a midwife. Like I think that's awesome, obviously, but how did like friends and family react? I think now all of my friends are literally from the birth community. I've got like maybe three long term friends that are quite aligned with me or they just know what I'm like. Like they... They, I suppose, trust my decision making. But all the rest are all in the birth community, either home birth or free birth themselves. So in that aspect, it was fine. Even my family are the same, quite aligned. I told my mum, I just said, oh yeah, I'm just going to have a daughter. And I just didn't really get into what that meant. And then about halfway through my pregnancy, she said, you're not having midwife are you?" And I was like, no. And she goes, oh, okay. And that was the whole conversation. And you know, I've had conversations with her after that where we've spoken about, you know, birth and hospitals and she gets in the whole conversation with me about obstetricians and she's fully on board now, which is so funny. But no, this time, no, I think, you know, some people, I had a client that was asking me a lot of questions and I just was saying, I'm just birthing at home the same. And then she was asking who my midwife was and I was like, Oh, I don't know yet. I'm still deciding. So I was trying to be really broad, but then I was getting like specific questions. I didn't want to lie. So I was just a bit like, like, see Daisy about it. But yeah, everyone else knew. And then everyone that came to my mother's blessing knew so we could openly talk about my birth, which was really cool. Yeah. Did you go into labor or birth thinking, you know, obviously we talked about the breathing, but like in terms of any, well, equipment sounds very like sciencey and, you know, very white room, but like. I don't know, was there any like equipment that you wanted to use that was different to Alaska's? Like, for example, me, I really wish I had a used a birth comb. I really want to know what it's like to use a birth comb. Did you have anything like that? Yeah. So there was a few things I did. I have a beautiful friend that is a doler in Sydney and she has like the coolest of doler kits. So she had. she had like birth combs and she had this thing called the birth weapon, which is essentially like a spiky wooden ball. And also a friend lent me the L10s machine, which in my first birth, I just had an Aldi 10s machine. And can I just say for the record, if you are going into birth, do not get an Aldi 10s machine. They are great for like muscle pain. they are not great for birth. The L10s machine was actually like the best thing I think I have ever witnessed. To the point where I knew I needed in my labor, I knew I needed to get in the water. I was like, need to get that relief. But also I was terrified of taking my 10s pads off because they were just like the best thing ever. So I did use all of them, the birth comb and the birth weapons, but I actually didn't use the birth comb in that until I was literally like nelly pushing, I was already in the water. But yeah, the tans machine, definitely a goer. Yeah. Do you, I'm so excited then. Do you want to walk us through like the lead up to labor and birth then? Yeah. So I, um, I've always been like that person, like, just wait for labor, like, don't stress about it. And I, I sort of thought, oh, I'm going to go to 42 weeks. I know you should never put numbers on it. And I was like, oh, 42 weeks, probably like, no way I would go over that, like again. And so I was positive, so great until I got to like 42 and one and I was like, oh. I'm over being pregnant and I started getting it out like negative Nancy. Mainly because I actually had an incredible pregnancy. I was like the like I didn't even feel pregnant but just the not knowing like not planning things or like my husband would go to work and be like oh should I like extend my leave again because like I didn't want him to take leave when I didn't have a baby yet. Just like that unknown. But I just was just like keeping busy and moving a lot. So the day before I went into labor, I woke up in the morning and I was like, I'm going to go do some shopping for my daughter. And I was childless and it was really amazing. And then I went straight to prenatal yoga, which was like an hour and a half. And I did this yoga session and I was like, oh my gosh, this was the best thing ever. And I just felt this huge. whole body of a lease. I just felt really ready. And then there was a show on. So I went and picked up my husband and my daughter and we went to this local show and I think I walked around for like five hours. We got home at like 10 p .m. at night. So I had a really big day and the next morning I woke up and I was still like just had the same cramps that I'd had for like a month. I'd had like real achy period type cramps, but nothing had really progressed. And I started painting with my daughter and my birthkeeper text me and she just checked in on me for the week. And I was like, yep, still got the same things. Nothing's changed. No different sensations. And within like five minutes of sending that message, I wrote back. Um, actually, I think something might be different today. And then like 10 minutes later, yeah, something is definitely happening. And looking back at my messages with her, it was so funny. My timing, like I, I kept thinking, um, I had lots of time when intuitively I knew that I was very close. Um, so I, yeah, just started feeling like, the crimps were becoming more consistent and then they weren't going away. Usually like by the time I get out and about and do stuff, they ease off. And they weren't doing that. So I was like packing up with my toddler. She was like running around with pain all over her. I had pain on me and I started getting like really intense crimps. And I was like, oh, this is like, I'm getting irritated. I was in like irritated stage. Yeah. Um, And I was like, Oh, maybe I'm in pre-labor. And so I made a big batch of labor aid. I set up my birth space because like having a toddler, I couldn't really do that until the day off. So I did that and my husband just blew up the pool and she was like fixated on it. She was jumping off my furniture, doing front flips into the like empty birth pool. And she had all her toys in there. It was so funny. Yeah. Um, and that was probably like midday and then by one o 'clock we would I was like I'm just gonna rest and watch a movie and try and get as much rest as possible and I was ended up on the birth ball and then I was like oh I feel like I need to get my tens machine on because it was getting like quite intense. So yeah my I did that and I was sort of unbothered like I didn't really notice my daughter around me to be honest, but my husband, I think was stressing more. He was like seeing her like jump on me and like jump in the birth pool and he was like, I'm going to take her out for the afternoon. And I was like, okay. And once they left, it like really wrapped up. In my labor at Alaska, I labored for the overnight all by myself and I loved it. And same here. I labored. most of my birth by myself and it was just incredible. I pretty much once they left, I got my headphones in, I had my tans machine on and I was like feeling like I just needed to move through each contraction. So I was like dancing through them, like swaying my hips and it was just, it just really helped. I felt like if I got one and I wasn't prepared, like I was just sitting on the birth ball and I hadn't stood up and moved yet, I was like, they were really overwhelming. But if I was just moving through them and I had like a really upbeat song on, it just was like, it just flowed really well. I felt quite quickly that I needed a change of scenery. So I went out onto my back deck. And I labored in the sun for a while and it was like a 30 degree day. So after like an hour of that, I was like, whoo. And I, my doula birthkeeper checked in and she was like, what do you want me to come? And here I am like thinking I could still have like three days. So I'm like, no, no. Like I feel fine. I'll call you when I like really feel like I need someone. And my husband was like, do you want me to come home? And I was like, no. And then within like 10 minutes, I text her and said, can you come now? Cause she was an hour and a half away as well. And I called my husband and I was like, I need you to get ice. I need you to get Alaska's bag ready and send her to my brothers. And that's like all I said. I was like, that was my last like thinking brain. I like was like, this is my direction. I just need that. Um, And he got home maybe 10 minutes later and I was in the shower on all fours and I was like roaring. Wow. And I was, I heard like Kim get my daughter out the door and she got picked up and I was like, birth pool filled up now. Like I just need it now. And I was like in the shower and I was like, Oh shit. Am I getting in the birth pool too early? I like, I just wasn't sure. Like. looking back, I was so progressed in labor, but I just always had that in the back of my mind, like, Oh, is it too early? The other thing I didn't say was, um, weeks before maybe like two or three weeks before I'd lost like a lot of my mucus plug. Okay. Yep. And it was like one of those things where you're like, Oh, it could mean labor's three hours away or it could mean it's like three weeks away. Um, but coming up to this labor, I hadn't lost my mucus plug. My waters didn't break until baby was coming out. So I was still feeling like I hadn't had these things happen. So it could be ages. But yeah, I remember like hobbling from the shower down. I've got like three little steps in my house and then into the birth pool and the lounge room. And I got in and it was, it probably had like no water in it. Like. He just had the hose hit me. I think he'd been filling up for like three minutes and he's like, Oh, it's still cold. And I was like, I'm getting in. And I just got in and started laboring in there and it just went so quick. At that point was when, like when I was in the shower and when I moved to the birth pool, I was in transition now that I look back on it. But. At the time I was just thinking like, oh, this is really intense, but I'm going to meet this intensity and I'm going to like welcome it. And I'm not going to fear the next contraction because I know that this actually means my baby's really close. And so that was my mindset. And. Um, one of my beautiful friends, um, she makes affirmation cards and she gave me a set on, and one of the, um, cards that had her like riding a bike up a hill. And it said something like, I just need to breach the peak and then I get the downhill run. And I always had that in my head as well. It's like the contractions actually only really intense for like 10 seconds. It's like you go up and then you hit the peak and then you can come back down. And so I always visualized that as well. So I got in the birth pool and the one thing that I like crave in labor is icy cold water like ran over my head and my back. Okay. So hubby had got the ice. He was just putting like the washes in the ice and pouring it over me. And then I asked for the birth clones. And I started. My labor, I wouldn't say it was pain free, it was super intense, but it was enjoyable. I just had this ecstatic feeling, I can't explain it. I was just smiling and laughing through it. It was so, so intense, but every time I got that wave of holy shit, I would just go, I'm going to meet them. I'm doing this, I'm so close. And you know, there's videos that I was saying, oh my, like they're coming, I'm doing it. I'm so close, I'm going to meet them. Um, yeah, it was just so cool. And my, by the time my birthkeeper got there, um, I like, I remember her walking in the door and my birth pool was like at the front door and just, just perfectly. She just slotted in. We didn't, no one exchanged words. Wow. she just picked off a washer and took over what Jessie was doing. And it was only like, it was only five minutes after she arrived and I had come out of a contraction and I was like, oh, like Jenna. And I started interacting with her. Um, and yeah, she just, they both just did that. I think she was putting them on my head. He was running them over my back. Um, and I, yeah, I felt, that transition from the front contractions to that bearing down feeling. And I was saying, throughout my labor, I was communicating with them what was happening. So I was like, Oh, yeah, I'm bearing down. Like, I've just felt the pressure change. And this, this time around, it was so different. So like with Alaska, I got that bearing down feeling and that pressure move from my front to my back and I laid down and it was enjoyable and I could relax. This time I got this like bare down feeling and it was just like baby is it coming out? Like you're not relaxing. Like, and it felt there was, I went and seen Born at Home, the movie the other night and a lady described it perfectly, but she said, no one told me it felt like my sacrum was going to tear in half. And that is exactly what it felt like. It was just like this heavy, heavy feeling, no break, no rest. I remember going, okay, this is my time to rest. I'm gonna like put my head on the side of the birth pool. And I experienced the fetal ejection reflex in its full force. Where the only way I can describe it is when I lay down. It felt like I had to do a projectile vomit and my whole body went like forward. Whoa. And I was trying to fight it. I was like, no, I'm resting. Oh, and there was, that wasn't happening. And it just was like this rush baby was coming out and I think my husband was like doing something with like the towels or water or something like that. And I like yelled out to him and then I'm. I did post a video on my Instagram where I'm like, the head's out. And that was the part where I was like yelling out to him and he came over to the birth pool and I was like, the head's out. Like it's already here. And then I just sat for a little bit and I could feel baby turning and I was saying to them, oh, baby's just rotating. Which is like the difference in my first birth. I was looking at someone else. I was looking at a midwife. during transition to help me and I was looking at a midwife during the pushing stage to tell me what was happening where this time I knew everything that was happening and I was telling the other people around me which I thought was really cool like just in full control the whole time. And yeah then baby just like shot out. I really tried to slow it down like. as much as I could and just breathe and I was going just soften, just soften. Cause I, I just felt the pressure was so intense. Um, and yeah, baby comes straight out. Um, he was like crying straight away. He was pink. He was like a beautiful color. Um, and it was like so uneventful. Like when I think back on it, I just pulled him up, had him on my chest and everyone was like quiet. Yeah. Like it was just like a normal, like yeah, it's like a normal boring free birth. It was just like this normal boring thing that just happened. And even like my husband didn't come over to me straight away. Like in the video, they're all just like staring and I just had baby uninterrupted. And then after a little bit, he's one job, which I told him is like when baby comes out, I need to make sure the aircon's off. and you've got like a warm towel to put over us when I'm ready. And he was just standing in the corner with like a towel. So yeah, he put, he come over with the towel and then we all just like had a bit of a laugh about like what happened. And they both said to me like, Oh my gosh, you're going to look over that video and think and say that looked so easy. It just, yeah, it was just such a. surreal birth. So what time did you end up having him? 7 o 'clock. Yeah. So I was probably in like, from like proper contractions to baby out was seven hours, but which felt so quick. Like when I hear people say they had a two hour labor in labor land, it's so... Like time isn't a thing, so I think, wow, that would be intense. That felt really quick for me. And yeah, I asked for some labor aid and my birthkeeper got me some of that and I just sat in the pool and my husband came over and gave us a cuddle. And then my birthkeeper, I asked for some no -bleed tincture because I'd noticed... With Alaska's birth, I didn't bleed at all in the pool. The pool was spotless. This one, I noticed it was quite dark. I think I was just more aware because I'd done so much self -education and you're taking your birth into your own hands. I was quite aware of things like that. Not like I want to be a midwife, but I was thinking, oh, like... There's probably a lot of blood in this pool, so I might take a tincture now. So I did that. And then I asked to get out of the pool. It was just so cool because I birthed him in the same spot that I birthed Alaska. And then like... I got onto the same lounge and they had it all like the towels were in the lounge and I breastfed him in the same spot that I breastfed her and it was just yeah one of those really cool things about home birth where I was getting like deja vu almost. But yeah I got on the lounge and I breastfed him and he was just like he was straight on the boob like so easy and he just sat and fed for ages. and I really hated birthing my percentile the first time. I felt like I was so exhausted and I'm not really prepared for it. Like you know how people say now like you know birth isn't over until the percentage is birthed. I didn't really know that in my first birth so I was like... ready to clock out. And then like an hour or so after birth, my midwife was like, Oh, you know, the placenta is still a thing as well. And I hated that. I like I was just the feeling of it coming out. And I felt like it was such an effort. I hated it. So I really worked on that with my birthkeeper this time. She does a lot. She works with placentas, like encapsulating them and stuff like that. And um, she did a lot of like visualization with me around like letting my placenta release and you know come away from my body and all that so we did that and it was like 20 minutes after birth I was like I think I need a poo and I was like feeling really uncomfortable and she knew so she like she come with the placenta bowl. and I like nearly got to the toilet and it just plopped out and she caught it. Oh she caught it! Yeah she like put the bowl like straight under me. Yeah. But I was like no it's definitely a poo like and it was my placenta. Yeah. So yeah after that I um I think yeah I just gave Bub over to Dad and I went and had a shower and my birthkeeper made me like a rice pudding and um. Wow. Yeah, gave me some more tinctures and stuff like that. And then within two hours, oh, my daughter came home as well. She was like packed and ready for her first ever sleepover. And then like two hours later, we're like, can we have her back? Like we've got a baby now. And so yeah, she came in and met him and then within two hours, I was in bed with Bob and going to bed for the night. Um, so yeah, that was the birth. Just another day. Just another day. Started the day just normal playing with my daughter and then yeah, that night had a baby in bed. Yeah. Such a non, a special but non event. Just. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Um, I have had a pretty eventful postpartum though. Okay. Um, which amazing birth, pretty eventful postpartum, which in hindsight, so grateful that I prepped in terms of like meals and having a meal train. And I think like, no matter where you're choosing to birth, you need to, um, you need to prep the postpartum like you're going to have a cesarean. Like, I think that's the best advice. Like you just never know what's going to happen. And, um, You know, my husband was really lucky. He had eight weeks off. So my first month was literally just resting. Yeah. Which is incredible. And we pretty much had a full month of meals dropped to us. So like we're only just starting to cook now and like he's doing all the cooking. So it's been amazing. But pretty much day two. I had no pain. I had like no burning when I weighed or anything, but I was like, Oh, I should probably just check my like perineum just to make sure I haven't tore or anything. Um, I had a secondary tear with Lasky and I just let that heal naturally and that healed really well. Um, and I checked and I was like, that's the other thing, especially if you're free birthing, um, take or get familiar with your vagina before you give birth because I was like, I actually haven't like checked it out since before I had babies. Like if I'm honest, I haven't actually sat with a light and looked at it. So true. Oh my gosh, this is like your revolutionary mouth. Is this the bit you're going to sniff it in your... Yes! Everybody go and analyse your vaginas. Go and check your vagina. Only because I was like looking and I'm like... I don't know if that's just my vagina because it's swollen, because I've just given birth, or like, do I have a tear? And then I started noticing like this little sort of tear down my perineum. But every time I look at it, it looked different. Like it looked, one time it looked like not that big of a tear. And then I checked like a couple of hours later and it looked bigger. So I was like, oh, and I kept thinking like. At the end I was thinking, I think this might be something more that I'm comfortable with managing at home. I just had a feeling that I could see it down towards my anus, so I was like, that's not something I've experienced before. And I knew that if I was to go get like, suture or anything like that, there's sort of a time limit on how far after birth that's really effective. So... I was like really stressed and really having like this push and pull like do I want to go to a hospital? I ended up deciding to go get assessed. And really the heart, I just didn't want to leave my bubble. Like I didn't want to leave my baby. I didn't want to take him in. So I had my husband just like in the car with the kids and I went into maternity. and had to explain my situation. And it was just, it was a really interesting perspective because they were obviously, some of them were quite good, but I knew that they were judging my choices. But you know, when I was in the maternity unit, I was seeing some things that were far beyond physiology. Like I wasn't hearing. I think I was there for six hours altogether and it was just women getting wheeled to surgery. You could not hear one woman roaring or in full labour. The whole maternity ward was full but you couldn't actually hear what I've experienced labour to be. Women literally getting wheeled, OBs running, women... getting wheeled down to theatre. It was a really interesting experience. Did anybody say any backhanded weird comments? The thing was they were really short staff so I kept having midwives come in and they'd have to run off. There was one OB, I think there was two OBs on but there was one OB that kept coming in to me and then having to run off again. And it was like every person I met, I explained my situation. And when I was in the room, I heard the OB telling another new midwife what my situation was. And I heard her say, I just don't get that. Like after she told me, after she said that I birthed at home with no midwife, et cetera. And then that. same midwife had to come into the room and start talking to me and I'm like, they were quite good to be honest. They were asking questions around Bob like, oh, was it your first or second? And oh, was your birth good? And I was like, yeah, perfect birth. So I asked to get assessed and I had a midwife finally be able to assess me and this is actually what really like effed me up. She was like, I'd obviously done research before I went in around what a third or a fourth degree tear looked like. Even on the free birth page, you need to get these attended to because if you don't, they can have pretty long consequences down the track. I had an idea about what each degree looked like and then I had a midwife check me over and she was like, yep. look I think you've just got a really clean tear. We probably wouldn't suture it. It looks really clean. You're probably good to go. I'll just go check it with the doctor. And so I'm like, yep, cool. All right, like I'm leaving, got my everything together. And then the OB finally came back like half an hour later and said, oh no, I need to assess you. And they did. And they were like, look, it's a third degree tear. You'll need to go straight to theater. And I was like, the anxiety that came over me. Because you're by yourself for this too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I felt sick to my stomach and I have a huge fear of hospitals, I have a huge fear of needles. I have to go to the dentist, I don't get the numbing needle, I just get the work done. So I straight up was like, no. I just straight up said no and they were like, what? And as soon as she said that the OB got rushed to an emergency and she was like, sorry, I have to go. I can't answer your questions. And so I think I sat there for a few hours like, hello, like, can someone come and answer the questions I have? And I finally was able to chat to her again. She just kept getting called off to like another emergency. And I, yeah, I use like the brain method, you know, like, it's like the decision making tool in labor. I sort of use that. And I was like asking what are the other options? Like I'm not having surgery. And I was very clear. And they pretty much made out that there was no other option. So I was like, okay, can I just get sutured up? And pretty much the response was that there's no evidence to say that would work or that would hold together. You will be incontinent. You will have issues having sex for the rest of your life. Um, it was like so much fear mongering. Um, and I was like, okay, I want to go and feed my baby. Um, I needed to have a break from here. So I went back to the car and I spoke to my husband and I sat, it was like three or four AM at this point. And I sat on my phone and I looked at every bit of research I could and like every bit of personal experience. And, um, I. just went back in there and said, I'm just getting sutured up and that's it. Like I'm not going for surgery. I want you to do it right here. I asked like a list of questions before that. And they basically said, okay, but you would have to sign something to say you're going against medical advice. And I was like, yep, cool. So I got sutured up and that was it. And I went home and It was so funny. I had no pain until I got the stitches and oh my God, peeling with stitches is like next level. My experience was actually amazing because I was on bed rest and I did a lot of things like I was putting like nori seaweed on it and I had manuka honey and I was doing like everything I could. I was eating like bone broth and only eating like really nutrient dense foods. I pretty much would get up to go to the toilet and shower and that was it. Like my husband would change baby. Um, and I healed really well. Um, yeah. Cause this so remind me when this is I like two or three days post -birth. Yeah. So it would have been two days post-birth. And now you're five weeks post -part. Yeah. Now I'm five weeks. I've had a checkup. It's all healed. Um, I don't have any, yeah. Any issues. Um, And I've been, I've like, I'm now connected with the pelvic floor physio from like six weeks just to do like, I suppose like preventative stuff with my pelvic floor. But yeah, that was my experience, which really changed my postpartum because like I had to go three days after that. What are the conditions? When I said I wanted to get sutured was that I'd have to go back for appointments. with them for monitoring to make sure it wasn't getting infected and it was probably going back together and all that jazz. But it was awful because the appointments, I've never been in a maternity unit. I didn't know how they worked, but it's like you have an appointment, but you still go there and you wait like six hours. So I went there and I'm like, watching all these women waiting for just like their normal appointments. And they're just waiting and waiting and waiting. And I'm like, what the hell? Like, it was just such a weird. I just wanted to be in bed. So I was like, culled up on like a chair in the fetal position. And I didn't go back after that. Like once I got that check, I didn't go back. So yeah. They can say all they want, but like, you know, you're not their hostage. Yeah, I know, right. Oh my gosh. And I think like, I don't want like my experience to deter people from getting help if like, if they have a serious tear, like I think it's something you really need to lean in yourself. There's also with like a third degree tear, there's like a 3A, 3B, 3C, and she pretty much said mine was like just a 3A. Yeah. when I weighed up my options, I was like, I'm not going for surgery for that. And if for some reason down the track, I had issues that had stemmed from it, I would look at surgery then like not when I have a newborn. Like I just wasn't on my radar at all. Yeah. So yeah, like birth was amazing. But I'm really proud that I like, I suppose like I utilize the system when I felt like I needed it. And yeah, I had to sort of advocate for myself in a way. But yeah, don't be afraid to anyone like listening out there if you feel like it's something that you need to get assessed or you know, you need to seek medical, it doesn't ever take away from the birth that you've had. See, I think that's important. Whoa. Wow. So powerful Mel, like, I'm so jealous. Not that I don't know that I don't love my own experiences, but I'm just like, oh my gosh, that's so joyful. I love, I love both stories. Um, and yeah, like go you like, absolutely. Like the system is there for a reason. Um, and you know, you, you know, trusted yourself and you know, made a decision, made an informed decision. I mean, somewhat crazily, you know, by the research that you did yourself, because like none of them clearly had time to sit down with you and like, tell them X tell you X, Y, Z. They just gave some blanket statement about there's no evidence. Well, have you looked at the evidence? When's the last time you looked like? That is such a good point. Well, actually, what I was finding was that, you know, she said to me, Every 100 % of people that give birth in a hospital get the surgery. Like the only people that don't get it are people that are at birth outside of the hospital. And so when I'm looking at all these experiences online and people that are talking about incontinence and they're talking about severe issues they've had and their sutures opening up and not being able to sit six months postpartum, these are all people that have had the repair surgery. So I'm looking and I think one of the statistics was like 25 % of women that have actually have long -term issues. So I'm thinking like, okay, like I'm weighing up in my head going, you know, I don't actually think that that's the best option for me. Yeah. Yeah. And I think, yeah, like, like you determine your own risk and telling someone, um, you know, almost a lie, like there is no evidence or there's not good evidence, like whatever. That's like a very blanket statement and they're making this decision for you essentially, because they're trying to push you into choosing this thing that makes them feel safe, but it doesn't make you feel safe. So like, go you, kick ass, like amazing. Um, and. Yeah. I've loved watching, um, on tick tock and Instagram, the bits that you've shared of this whole journey. And I'm so grateful that, um, you're sharing, um, again on the podcast. And yeah, like, I feel like, obviously I'm not a midwife, but I feel like, you know, I feel like, you know, when midwives have. support a woman with a birth and then a couple of years later they also support a woman, like that same woman with the birth. I feel like that's the continuity. I feel like, oh my gosh, I'm going to have all of these guests now that have other babies. I've just got to think that we know new women, just new babies. I'm like that on the Empowered Birthers. When somebody, I'll have people, like the night they give birth, be like, do you want another birth story? I have people message me like, I had my baby yesterday. Like, oh my gosh. How good is it though that like women are having, they're so thrilled about their birth that they can't wait to share. Like it's, yeah, it's amazing. Yeah. Yeah. Well, um, yeah, if you love this episode listeners as much as I have, make sure you let me know. I love like hearing about it and um, Yeah, did you have anything else that you've just remembered or like want to say Mel? I had actually thought last night around like, I think I was looking at past posts and I remember in my first birth, like actually feeling like I was going to die. Yeah. But like I remember making a post about it saying like, you in in labor, you might actually feel that you're going to die. That means you're like, Mel, you there. I didn't have that. Like I didn't have. any sense of losing control. Like it was just fully in control the whole time of that birth. Which is yeah, I don't know if it's like women that are free birth or sub like people that have had multiple babies if you just get more like familiar with the sensations. But yeah, it was just such an incredible like I'm still on a birth high like five weeks later. Yeah, like completely on an oxytocin high still. Well, like that's what you planned for. And, you know, if you plan like in a way that, you know, if you plan for postpartum, like you've had a C -section and if you plan your birth and, well, not plan your birth, but, you know, think about your dream birth and make steps to try and achieve that then like. I mean, this could be you too, listeners. Thank you so, so much.